What Miscavige is doing and why

Devil3

 

Article by Morris Adams

Here are some thoughts on what Miscavige is doing and the reasons why.

First some facts (or at least I think they are facts):

  1. Miscavige is accumulating a lot of money and wealth by conning people and fooling people.

  2. Miscavige is destroying the Church of Scientology.

  3. Miscavige does not want to help anyone but himself.

 

From my viewpoint, this is what he is actually doing.

He knows he is doing these things. (Well actually (3) is not a doingness, but it’s true anyway.)

I’m sure you don’t dispute (1), and also that he knows he is doing this.

It is very obvious that he is doing (2), but you may dispute the fact that he knows he is doing this. I am sure he knows this also. He is not stupid. And if so many of us Indies can see that the church is being destroyed, then you can be certain that he can see this also.

He has the actual stats, and you can be sure he looks at them.

The church being destroyed means, among other things:

  1. Auditing and training not being done.

  2. Membership declining markedly.

  3. The repute of Scientology and LRH going into the toilet and being flushed into the sewer.

You know that he wants to do (1), that is easy to see. But he also wants to do (2) – destroy the church of Scientology.

Both of these are his intentions.

It is easily understandable to most of us that there are people who would do (1), particularly if they also had the viewpoint of (3) in the first list above.

But why would Miscavige want to do (2) – destroy the church of Scientology?

Here is why:

Miscavige is an SP and harbors a secret fear (all-consuming fear, really) that he will be harmed by people in his environment. So he beats people down – physically, mentally and spiritually.

Per LRH, what you and I and real Scientologists are going for is to become OT. This means to have super abilities, super powers, super perceptions, awareness, knowingness.

From Miscavige’s point of view, if he is in such danger now, imagine what danger he would be in if people started to really achieve super powers, abilities, awareness, etc.

So it is IMPERATIVE to Miscavige to cripple the Bridge, to destroy the Bridge, to make sure NO ONE gets any real OT abilities from the Bridge.

And in fact, he is probably right in his thinking about this. If even one person became really OT, that would be it for Miscavige. If I became really OT, just about the first thing I would do (after insuring the survival of my body) would be to eliminate Miscavige from the scene. (My preference for how to do this would be to completely expose and discredit him, very publicly, so no one would ever take him seriously again.)

Miscavige cannot allow a single person to become really OT. He knows he is not OT, and he knows that if there were a real OT around, it would be all over for him.

So he MUST destroy Scientology. Which is what he is doing.

One final point:

Many people think that Miscavige works very hard, and of course he says he does. But this is not true.

Would you really call what he is doing “work”, even though he might spend a lot of time at it?

It is more like self-indulgence, or living out a fantasy or a dramatization. It all has a destructive purpose and destructive results, so a rational person couldn’t really call it “work”. It is work in the same way that the activities of Adolf Hitler, Josef Stalin, Kim Jong-il or Saddam Hussein would be called work.

His products are “overt products”, destructive products. Can someone who is creating continuous and only overt products be said to be doing “work”? I don’t think so.

If he put the same amount of time into actually expanding Scientology, maybe he would get even more money than he is now. But he doesn’t want to do that.

The arguments I give here about why Miscavige has the intention to destroy Scientology are based on technical bulletins and tapes by LRH. I don’t know the exact references and don’t have time to research these right now. If anyone knows what these references are, please feel free to list them in comments to this post.

A few that I know of, that are at least related to what I say above are as follows:

PAB (Professional Auditor’s Bulletin) “On Human Behavior”

HCOB 27 September 1966 “The Anti-Social Personality – The Anti-Scientologist”

C/S Series 22 “Psychosis”

Tape – “A Talk to Ethics Officers World-Wide”

All written materials are available on-line, thanks to one or two great Indie individuals.

As reported previously on this blog, many SCN materials can be freely obtained from the site www.stss.nl

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136 thoughts on “What Miscavige is doing and why

  1. Curious. The Scientology Money Project reached an almost opposite conclusion.

    As someone who had never been involved in Scientology, I have no idea how to tell which is right.

      • Great article, Morris. YoFirst some facts (or at least I think they are facts):u and LRH right about the SP has a secret terror that others will become strong and OT and will come after them because they know if they were strong and OT, they would go after all the others to destroy them. So the SP destroys anything that makes OTs as a way to have his own self-protection, or so he thinks.

        The only change I would make in your article is in this line: “First some facts (or at least I think they are facts)” Take out that you “think” they are facts. That almost sounds apologetic. The reader knows that what you are writing is your opinion based on what you’ve read and observed. So leave it at that and remove that last part in parentheses. It makes for a much stronger, better article.

  2. Good one Morris, COB has many peoples attention units stockpiled! Most indies hate the goblins guts for being so easily duped and for the abuse he so casually mets out. Then theres the guilt most go through for aiding and abetting the little toad, regret for giving up so much time/money to the mo..@#%ker! It’s not so easy to confront for anybody. Some people are so enraged they despise LRH, the tech and even the word scientology after the bubble bursts! Who can really blame them? Just have to watch out we dont go the same way and languish in the shame, blame and regret game. Despite the wounded screaming kool aider, El con and other absurdities, there is plenty to get while the gettings good! Questions is how many still want it? More than we think methinks!

    I do know that with DM behind bars or vapourised, minced and slow roasted would create planet wide floating TA’s!! Fireworks cellebrations and great relief would follow. I mean it will be a grand time indeed. I pray for that day, every day.

      • Loving your impassioned speech, Sheeplebane, sending ways of joy up my spine. And, yes Morris, it’s coming!

      • Morris I believe so too! I grow increasingly impatient none the less. I see a wounded and still greedy shark circling his little pond preventing the other fish from joining their breathrin!

        Instead of starving him out the slow way, does anyone have a high powered spear gun? Anyone?

  3. Dear Morris,

    I so much agree with your observations, and it reminded me of some of my own from earlier years, see here below. You’re also welcome to see my essays on this subject on my home page PINGOVINO!

    Love
    Per

    How could so many be so stupid
    March 25th 2011
    by Per Schiøttz

    “SP” – “PTS” Series 5

    Have you ever seen mass-PTSness? Many, many people being PTS to the same one person or one group of persons or one thing, etc..? There are stellar examples of this in present society and in history too. I don’t think there has been any time – on this planet – where there were not examples of mass-PTSness. What is this phenomenon anyway? Let’s take one of the stars: Adolph Hitler, “Der Führer”. There is no question of his bad deeds – I am sure. If in doubt, consult history books, films and videos and go see some of the World War II museums in Germany and France. You will know what I mean.

    Where did Hitler get his power from? The people of course, you might say, and rightly so. Everybody admired him (at least in the beginning) for his fantastic (and fanatic) ideas of a free German people, only the people didn’t see that the freedom was to be his, as he stole the freedom from the people, who gladly gave their power to him by having them agree to his mad ideas and adopting these crazinesses. This is how the people made themselves PTS to Mr. Hitler.

    If you can agree to the above explanation, then suppose everybody had turned his/her back to Hitler. What power would he then have? Nothing !! All the power he ever had was given to him by the people. Had all of them, from Eva von Braun to the 14 years old private soldier in Hitler’s army, all of them, turned their back to him, he would have remained a snotty little corporal in a jail in Austria.

    You can take any and every big bad terrible “SP” in history, like Napoleon and Stalin, just to mention a few more, and see that the pattern is exactly the same. Had everyone turned their backs to these cats, they would have had no power, nothing, silts, nada.. People would be free. These war lords have a strange idea that you can get peace by making war.. how weird..

    It is said, and I believe in that, that man is basically good. It doesn’t say beings, it says MAN, that means to me people on this planet. People being humanoid, members of the human race… Man. (or even mankind). And any men on other planets too, and woman… (I do believe that it should encompass all beings too).

    But some of these men and women act like nobody told them that they are good, good and decent down deep. To me it seems like they think that freedom is a quantity not a quality, and they better get whatever they can lay their dirty hands on. Then when they do this, people around them makes themselves smaller and go all effect of these cats.

    These cats CAN be helped. If you can get them into my auditing chair, then I know how to handle them, and it will be a pleasure for me to do so. They ARE good people, but they are stuck in an incident which they keep creating in the now. They think that the incident “then” is “now” and that the “now” is “then”. Being in that incident looking at the future, forward from then, they get a terrible sight with death and destruction and no freedom, so they better start grabbing. All you have to handle is THAT incident, and they will be out of it instantly. The source “creating”, the existence and the conditions they see and create, will be gone, when they move to the present now. We have what’s needed of knowledge, and we can even start with ourselves actually WITHOUT turning our backs to anyone or anything.
    Per Schiøttz

  4. Dear Morris
    No 4 making it VERY VERY difficult (almost impossible I would say) for customers to get THEIR ADVANCED PAYMENTS MONEY ……… BACK !!!!!

  5. HCO Policy 1 Oct. 1967 Management Series Vol. 3 page 371.
    Admin Know-How Series 15
    LRH says;
    “USES OF ORGS”
    “There are two uses (violently opposed to each other) to which Scientology orgs can be put. They are:
    1. To forward the advance of self and all dynamics toward survival.
    2. To use the great power and control of an org over others to defend oneself.
    When the decent being goes to work in an org, he uses 1.
    When a suppressive goes to work in a org, he uses 2.
    When you get in ethics, the decent one raises his necessity level and measures up. The suppressive type blows (leaves).
    It is of vital interest to all of us that we have orgs that serve to increase survival on all dynamics. And that we prevent orgs being used as a means to oppress others.
    The answer, oddly enough, is to GET IN ETHICS exactly on-policy and correctly and we will advance.”
    LRH

    • I remember a datum I came about somewhere in my HCO hatting back when:

      “When there is an SP aboard, the good staff will leave”

      Now we have an SP at the very top and the good Scientologists are leaving – or being kicked out.

      • Kent – 100% agree. Social Personalities won’t stick around for the abuse for too long. Many deserve bravery medals for trying, but the odds were just too great. The answer at the end of the day is to move on and create a new game where people can and are winning.

  6. Morris, this is quite right.

    If a person was a Scientologist and believed the tech works, and took on the job of running Scientology with the purpose of growing it, one would most likely apply that tech carefully and watch the results.
    The diminutive Pope on the other hand, selectively does not apply those policies which would continue to benefit the group. Those which are applied are generally those which can be interpreted or taken out of context and enforced to maximum negative effect.
    Republishing materials is done so that key data can be omitted and “corrections” made to further the negative impact.
    The bridge is redesigned to make sure the OT8 grads are faced with utter degradation of starting at the bottom again . Or they can leave, which seems to be the proffered choice. Around 90 percent of the OT8’s I know of have left. This is good for the poison dwarf because they can be expelled and attacked and maligned so they cannot interfere with the active public. Some few who have remained are fast becoming more and more robotic due to overrun on objectives trying to handle an aspect of the case which the OT8 theoretically no longer has.
    He’ll if this did not happen they may start asking really embarrassing questions like ” Where’s my OT9 and 10?
    Instead they can attend fundraisers .

    • “Apparently LRH ………….”

      COMMENT MODERATED. Your comment is off-topic. Please stay on-topic and stop trying to derail the discussion thread.

      • My comment answered the question, “Where is OT 9 and 10?”
        .
        That’s *on* topic.
        .
        It’s OK to say that you didn’t like the answer, so you won’t permit it.
        .
        Really. It’s OK.

      • LMR accused DM of avoiding the issue of OT9 & 10 by getting OT’s to re-do the lower bridge. DM and the Church claim these levels do exist, and that is why OT’s have to re-do the lower bridge “in order to prepare for 9 & 10”.

        According to some outside of RCS, not only do these levels exist, but people have done them (and beyond) outside of the Church.

        Others assert that OT9 & 10 do not exist and the bridge stops at OT8.

        It depends on who you speak to.

        The admins of this blog make no stand regarding the matter.

        Your comment did not answer the “question” by LMR – it asserted as fact something that is not necessarily true, and which you have no personal knowledge of. Thus it was your opinion, not fact.

        As usual you tried to pin this on LRH – as you usually do. Your stock-in-trade mantra of “it was all LRH’s fault” which we are all too familiar with and you know will get you moderated – but this doesn’t stop you.

        You obviously enjoy being moderated.

        We are happy to oblige.

  7. Great views Morris ,

    Behind any situation or problem lies the exact “Is-ness” of it ; the underlaying reason for its existence. This is called “The Why” in Admin Tech (3D tech) , and “The item” in auditing Tech (1D tech). The exact reason that “Opens the door to handling” , and that when acted upon, actually does improve and handle the existing scene.

    DM is not neither a “Why” nor “The item”. This so misguided idea that the “Charlatan of the Board” (COB) is an almighty SP capable of handling and suppressing thousands of people , is the biggest piece of nonsense I have ever heard.

    Scientologists miss this so much , that no ass-isness is ever achieved , as we are always handling the wrong target. The real target to handle is “an idea” , a “concept” , and not an individual. It is the idea that causes the entrapment itself.

    What exactly is this idea ? Well , it varies from individual to individual , but in general it has to do with assuming “facts” which are actually falsehoods. And what exactly are those falsehoods ; these assumed “facts” ? Here are the ones more fixed :

    1. That an SP can actually harm anyone.

    2. That Scn is the only route to salvation and total freedom , and that it actually accomplish those things.

    3. That the “wog world” is a very “dangerous” place full of “SPs” and “downtone” people.

    4. That LRH was right about everything he ever wrote about.

    5. That “Standard Tech” is infallible.

    6. That “SPs” are very dangerous and should be feared. This is the worse one.

    7. That “OTs” never go out-ethics , and are capable of embracing all dynamics once so “high” in the Bridge.

    8. That LRH is an “Authority” and that you always need to handle your life
    situations the “LRH way”.

    9. That we are incapable of discovering Truth by ourselves as we are mere “mortals” incapable of “raising above our banks”.

    10. That if we doesn’t move fast up the Bridge, we risk losing our “salvation” , and might spend the rest of our existence in oblivion.

    11. That phychiatrists are all of them the “merchants of evil” attempting to do everybody in.

    12. That government is a “monster” incapable of reason and change.

    13. That you must forcefully disconnect from others to handle “Suppression”.

    14. That DM was appointed by LRH himself and therefore, must be a good “leader”.

    15. That DM is a super “OT” , super “trained” individual.

    16. That LRH was infallible and a God-like individual with an impeccable ethics conduct.

    17. That “Freedom” is not to be found at the Field.

    18. That “squirrels” are very “dangerous” people, and most of them plain “SPs”.

    It is not the “SP” that causes the harm. It is the “uninspected idea” , the “false idea” (false assumptions) that trap us and cause the R/C and the state of being “suspended in time” at an indecision.

    W/out such false assumptions in place, no harm can be done to us, and we would just be able to ignore and put ethics in , in those corrupted souls we call “SPs”.

    The parshioners are basically trapped by their OWN ideas , and not by any an SP.

    So the correct TARGET to handle is not the “SP”, but the INDIVIDUALS being the effect of him. Can anyone experienced in PTS/SP handlings can remember how is that we effectively handled the PTS individual by just thoroughly educating him on the condition, and by getting him to really cognite on how exactly he precipitated his situation in the first place ?

    Do you remember how it worked so well ? We never needed to talk to or directly handle any “SP”. You know why exactly the “Suppressed Person RD” works w/out even contacting the “SP” element ? I mean, if it works, and it does work you know, then it is logical to assume that the reasons that the PTS individual was the effect of others in the first place lies within himslef, and are based on his OWN ideas.

    So the thing to do to handle the DM issue is to direct our attention at fully rehabilitating “Free Will” , “Self-determinism” , and the ability to “think for ourselfs” in others by an effective and far-reaching “false data stripping” action.

    The more attention is put in DM , the more mass is built up as you are running a “wrong item” in the list , and a wrong Why. The result is just a raising TA that never goes to normal range. The more attention is placed in the “CofS and DM” , the more BPC will be created.

    By attempting to “get rid of something” , our own protest in the matter only shows that we lack confront in the area in question. By putting our att in the negative instead of in the “rightness of beingness” , the negative only grows more , and we only get what we put our att on. We need to start stressing Human Rights more , and stressing as well self-respect and the abandonment of Authority. The only authority there is for an individual is his own belief in his potential for knowing Truth ; he IS his own authority ; the only one that ever exists.

    So by all means, keep on expossing the crimes, and specially supporting any action that protect the right of others. It is often necessary to smash the unduly while we educate others ; some control must also be put in in the scene. But that tends to be stressed too much. More emphasis should be put on Freedom (rehabilitating Judgement and self-determinism) , and less in barriers.

    My two cents.

    ARC,
    PETER

    • Extremely well written Peter. I could not agree more.
      While Miscavige does need exposure, he is not the Hho or the Why..
      Never in the history of Scientology has the Church’s venom, retaliation and abuse been given so much media, so much print, so much prime time.
      The draconian policies to punish are Hubbard policies.
      HCO Policy Letter of 5 January 1968, “Overfilled In-Basket, Bad News.” LRH says:

      “MAKE THE PENALTIES FOR NONCOMPLIANCE AND FALSE REPORTS TOO GRUESOME
      TO BE FACED AND ENFORCE THEM.”

      In the same issue, LRH also said, “It takes far more ethics and far steeper, enforced penalties to make an organization work than Scientologists have been using.”

      This was written in 1968, the year that “overboards” were instituted on the ship. And chain locker imprisonment. And cleaning out the bilges. Too gruesome.

      Later that same year, LRH wrote, in HCO PL 4 October 68, “Ethics Presence,” “Men will keep the accounts straight only because you can muster bayonets to enforce that they do.”
      Thus came the throwing overboard (Blindfolded) into the ocean people who could not swim. (LRH)
      Thus came INT base staff thrown into the feces pond (lake) routinely as punishment til people got so sick and then it was stopped and they would be thrown into the INT Base pool at 2am. (DM)
      Shelly Ashurst’s husband was locked in a chain locker at the tender age of 7 years old on the Apollo.

      The sadistic RPF and RPF’s RPF changed me forever.
      I was forced to run around a pole 12 hours a day for months. Torture. Feet swollen, ankles swollen, knees buckling.
      Talk about *ever being the same again*. I never was after the punitive running program. It was hell on earth.

      LRH gave broad and sweeping permission for escalating punishments, hence SP hole, hence all the kidnaps and held against will.
      If you have read the OSA Network Orders previously Guardian Orders they are blood chilling. ALL written by LRH.

      Nothing in the post negates any of the red on white or tech that others have found to be of great help and use.

      It is just that great and higher states of spirituality do not and cannot occur under intense abuse, force and overwhelm. The Sea org is the ultimate in unconscionably thuggery, force, overwhelm while pretending to themselves and others that they are moving on higher and having a positive sociological
      impact on the planet.

      • Karen – I couldn’t agree more.

        There are draconian policies and practices in SCN that have no place in today’s modern world. They should be cancelled and banned outright as criminal activities, and anyone who honestly intended to HELP others with the SCN tech would see to this as the first order of the day.

        The sad fact is that LRH did write such policies and personally presided over punitive actions that were downright abusive. Andrew is living proof of this, as are many others who suffered similar under his regime. When I was a young 6 month-old baby, my mother was on staff and not allowed to come home or bath or wear make-up because as the HES, she did not have a fully-hatted E/O on staff. People in lowered conditions had a dirty grey rag tied to their arms and were not to be spoken to or included in the group. How disgusting is this?

        Having said that, I also understand that these activities occurred at a time when physical punishment & torture was a societal norm when dealing with “miscreants” (perceived or not). Corporal punishment was meted out in schools and in homes – often brutally. Enrolees into the armed forces were brutally “broken down” so that they could be built up into killing machines – witness the thousands of broken & dysfunctional human beings returning from Vietnam, Korea, WWII and in South Africa from the SADF.

        Corporal punishment in schools and education institutions was the order of the day. As was beatings of children by parents – this was accepted “correctional action” for a misbehaving child. I remember as a 10 year-old child coming home with huge purple welts across the palms of my hands because I had misspelled some words in a test. The teacher had a steel ruler and would bring it thwacking down from above his head – sometimes even drawing blood in the process. One teacher (and funnily enough a SCN) threw a blackboard duster at me and caused my eyebrow to split open – and all I had done was giggled in the back of the classroom. Boys were sent off to the principal’s office to be “jacked” with a cane, often causing permanent damage – and often for mere transgressions that would be scoffed at today as “normal childhood behaviour”.

        Where Scientology has utterly lost the plot is that it is still “stuck” in a long-gone and now abhorred era of corporal punishment and torture. The world has moved on, and Scientology hasn’t. This plays right into the hands of evil-intentioned people and those who get their rocks off by applying “to the letter” these heinous acts and policies. And it’s one of the reasons why I have a problem with KSW fundamentalists. To stick to KSW means one embraces ALL of LRH. The good as well as the bad. And the bad is really, really bad. These people are bereft of the ability to differentiate between what is applicable and good, and what should be thrown in file 13.

        Any Social Personality or sentient being would take one look at these policies and see them for what they are. And would NEVER apply these horrible acts to others. I remember one of the most sane, kind and benevolent E/O’s in Joburg Org was Shannon Green (she is still in the Church). She was a gentle-natured, caring individual. She NEVER made anyone wrong for landing up in HCO – she truly believed in and used the ethics tech as a tool to HELP. I had a number of “handlings” with her, and I always came away feeling better and positive and having gained something. Sadly, she is about the ONLY person I can say this about. Most others would lick their lips lasciviously to see how much pain they could bring to bear – Sandra de Beer was a classic example, and a number of her “minions” who followed suit. One of the most evil, nasty and malevolent people I have met to date. She would make a perfect DM Minion. As for her husband Albert De Beer (ED JBG Org) – he is an arrogant prick and deserves his wife to a tee. He totally destroyed any last vestige of respect I had for him when he told my son that he was “acting like a dick” and then later on came barging for my daughter-in-law in such a threatening way that she honestly thought he was going to strike her. But then again, I also heard that he has been on the receiving end of a couple of beatings from non other than Greg Wilhere and Ken Krieger, so I guess it’s no wonder that he is now in the “winning valence”.

        And I believe the very nature of the Sea Org attracts such people. Social personalities do not last in the Sea Org. SP’s thrive. If anyone has been in the SO in today’s times for longer than 5 years, know that you are dealing with a nasty piece of work who has bought into the SP system and will sell his/her soul to the devil while meting out the most disgusting and abhorrent treatment of those around them – particularly anyone who they perceive as a threat (i.e. Social Personalities who are able and aware).

      • Great comment, Karen. Very telling references. I wasn’t aware of how much you personally suffered. I, very fortunately, was only in the SO for about 6 weeks before they routed me out (an amusing story). So I was saved from years of abuse and degradation. LRHs viewpoint of Scientologists, auditors and staff members really seems to have undergone a dramatic change from the 50’s to the 60’s. From looking at them with warmth and ARC and friendship, to looking at them as low-level humanoids that had to be strictly controlled. I wonder a lot abount what happened to cause this change.

      • Thanks for your validation Karen ; most kind.

        I always love your wise and well balanced comments. Particularly this one caught my eye : “It is just that great and higher states of spirituality do not and cannot occur under intense abuse, force and overwhelm”. So true dear, so true.

        ARC, PETER

    • Very Good Peter. Why not turn this comment into an article for the blog? It needs to be more visible than hidden in the comments. Maybe with a bit more meat on the bones.

      • Thanks for your validation kent ,

        There is one coming up. It totally covers all the points from a “Human Rights” perspective.

        Thanks for your comm.

        ARC PETER

    • Fantastic comment, Peter. I couldn’t agree with you more, and couldn’t add anything – you said it all – beautifully and succinctly.

    • Bang on TC, bang on! The truth of your assertions will be vindicated once DM is deposed and nothing changes or the scene gets worse. We will then know for sure. After that it will be all on the founders head completely I feel. LRH the charlatan, death to scientology may be the shout then. All wrong minded of course. So I agree its up to us, the individual too, who must decide which idea he will allow to penetrate his 3inch armour plate ie. skull and take hold!

      Yes its our own fault. Good or bad.

      Back to DM. We cant blame him for everything of course. But, and heres the big BUT this SOB is guilty of betrayal of the most sinister. He sells hope and freedom incased in yet more mental slavery and must be stopped – at all costs! Allowing him to continue his reign of terror is pure folley! Imagine for instance if his programs were succeeding. RCS altered tech being used ubiquitously and all other religeons brushed aside with secret agencies using the tech enmass to enslave entire populations. What a catastrophe of ultimate preportions it would be! If Hitler had had the tech and used it in reverse the world would very well be a stark place to exist in. Ghastly!

      Thats why I support the efforts of Mike Rinder and this blog. Its working. Halleluya!

      • Thanks Sheeplebane !

        I agree with your assessment too. Specially about the great work that Rinder and BIC is doing.

        DM should and will be handled , rest assured.

        For anyone interested , in aprox 6-8 months I’ll be taking a case directly to the ONU’s Human Rights Comission formally charging the Church for international Human Rights violations. I am going to need a lot of signatures and testimonies from all the people who has been a victim of abuses against their Human Rights. It needs to be exactly to the point giving the exact details, and including all evidence that you have. The more sworn testimonies I have, the better the case that I can present.

        This Commission doesn’t normally takes individual cases as they tend to refer those cases to the specific governments where the crime occured. But I have a strategy to go around that which of course, I can not publicly reveal.

        So I any of you dear posters, want to really do something effective about it , now is the time. We should take advantage of the momemtum that the coming HBO documentary is going to create. We’ll get Media exposure for free.

        Anyone interested, just get my e-mail address from dear BIC Admin and get with me on this.

        ARC, PETER

      • Thanks for announcing this Theta-Clear. Perhaps we should do an article on this – it’s very important information and worth spreading far and wide for maximum coverage. If you’d like to put something together explaining a bit more detail and exactly what is needed/wanted, BIC will gladly publish it.

      • Thanks for offering me the platform , dear BIC Admin ; I really appreciate it.

        I’ll put something together , and get back with you soon enough.

        ARC PETER

    • thetaclear (Peter), you wrote: “By putting our att [attention] in the negative instead of in the ‘rightness of beingness’, the negative only grows more, and we only get what we put our att on.”

      That is a very relevant principle with regard to the current state of affairs of scientology. It gets easily forgotten, even by those who recognize the truth in it, because of how much they feel let down by LRH.

      There have been different theories about what happened to LRH with regard to the drastic change in his views starting sometime after the early 50’s. Otto Roos believed it was due to grossly mishandled case (which Roos had a lot of inside knowledge about). Phil Spickler said the big change he observed as an insider started when LRH felt betrayed by his son Nibs. Marty Rathbun, in his last book, wrote about yet another theory, in which he describes how LRH was deceived by a journalist he had trusted and taken into his home for an extended period of time.

      To me, none of these theories ever quite explained the conundrum, because I just couldn’t see that someone who had gathered that much truth could have lost sight of it so quickly and so thoroughly – regardless of the circumstances. Recently, I came across another theory, not pertaining to LRH specifically, but to teachers or prophets in general (including Muhammad, for example, who also eventually turned to the use of force, even more so than LRH did).

      David Wilcock is a researcher of ancient civilizations and consciousness science, and author of two New York Times best sellers. In the video posted below, starting at about 15:00 and for the next several minutes, Wilcock first states (as do many others nowadays) that there is a preponderance of evidence for the existence of ETs who are far more advanced than we are in many ways, and who are attempting to help us. Then Wilcock goes on to say that one of the things these ETs learned in the 1950’s (the early era of Scientology, obviously) was that if they conveyed their wisdom via certain individuals, any such individual would become a messianic figure. And as a result, their egos would get inflated because now they felt special, like they were the anointed teacher.

      This, to me, is a very plausible explanation for what happened to LRH, something that would probably happen to almost any Earthling who had been given great wisdom.

      Peter, you also wrote: “The only authority there is for an individual is his own belief in his potential for knowing Truth; he IS his own authority; the only one that ever exists.”

      That also aligns with Wilcock’s findings. According to him, what the ETs realized is that there can’t be – and isn’t going to be – any one leader, such as the Second Coming of Christ. Rather, the Second Coming is YOU – meaning each of us. Wilcock’s view is that “the Christ principle” resides in all of humanity and is going to be awakened. He also points out that every single ancient tradition in history has documented records of angels with godlike abilities – the kind of abilities LRH described as “OT”.

      Wilcock’s view of the various religions is that they all contain in their basics everything one needs in order to follow “the way of God” (if you want to call it that, he adds). Basically, every tradition has had an individual who took his knowledge of the universe and expressed it in his or her own way. LRH’s way of communicating the truth he was given is still there for us – in the basic materials. And it still has the same huge degree of workability – to which we can add our own “authority as individuals”, to use your words, Peter.

      ARC,
      marildi

      • Thanks for your comm Marildi ,

        I am always impressed at your great erudition and keen insight into things.

        Curiously enough , I share Wilcock’s ideas to a greater or lesser degree , since quite some time ago. I never bought those reasons (from Marty, Otto and others) as the why of LRH’s drastic change in “strategy”. A man of the altitude and wisdom of LRH can’t just be controlled by mere mortals and by his own case. It is even laughable for me to even consider those “possibilities” for the obvious contradictions that they carry with them :

        In one hand , you have an individual who creates (compile and creates to be accurate) a technology that Earth had never seen. Before LRH, you had the great wisdom of incredible individuals and scriptures (like Buddha, Lao Tsè , The Vedas , The Upanishads , The Diamond Sûtra, etc) , but that knowledge was mostly meant for “priest-want-to-be” individuals , and for the “very spiritual aware” ones. The teachings were mostly in hymn-like form , or in poetic-rythmic kind of form ; a very difficult and impractical way to teach a subject. What LRH did that was original (Scn wisdom is not ‘original’ by a long ways) , was to put that already discovered wisdom in layman’s terms so that everybody could benefit from it ; a very honorable and gigantic task all by itself. He also was original in creating PROCESSES that could actually get others to duplicate some of that wisdom and make it their own (a knowingness instead of just knowledge).

        But in the other hand, you have that SAME individual , one who had had so far very “Human Rights Supporting” ideas and attitudes, make a 180% turn and become almost despotic , more or less after the mid ’50s as the initial “mild” signs, and very obvious from the mid ’60s on (when the “Suppressive Acts” list and “KSW #1” came up).

        Obviously , something just doesn’t add up here. What possible force can change a man like LRH ?

        It should be no mystery for people engaged in spiritual wisdom, that “hidden influences” has shaped the history of this planet since time immemorial. “Hidden influences” many times working from VERY far locations as Time-Space lose their meaning in a Theta-universe framework. Those influences has prevented so far , any true leadership to remain in “power” ; a very detailed study of humans’s history will reveal this , specially recent history (from 1000AC on).

        LRH mistakenly thought that he had handled the “hidden influence” issue with NOTs, and he was taken by the same powers he was trying to fight , as he apparently wasn’t aware of them.

        I don’t think that his great leadership was “channeled” by higher powers, but rather the opposite : it was suppressed by powerful “hidden influences”. The same thing happened to “The Pilot” (Ken Ogger) , the only researcher so far that I feel was comparable to LRH. I plan to follow their steps soon enough ; I hope that I don’t end up falling into “The Abyss” myself. But someone got to do it, you know. One saving grace that I do have, though, is that I have no other real oppterms other than the ones I create myself ; so I never really have “enemies”. I don’t fight “SPs”, “phychiatrists” , “government” , “The Church” , “DM” , or any of such items. I have no need to “fight” as I totally feel capable of controlling them , and totally understand the mechanics of it all.

        Very interesting view about what is meant by “The Second Coming”. I sincerely hope that you are right because if you are not , God help us all , cause with have no technology so far developved to handle the game that is about to begin being played in this God forsaken planet. Too many unexplained phenomena being reported lately by advanced satellites and telescopes. There are others who doesn’t want to be found, and will take any measures to avoid it. I hope that my fears never materialize , and that my perceptions be just the result of my own delusions.

        Thanks for the link on Wilcock’s Marildi ; I will surely look into it.

        ARC, PETER

      • Peter,
        Thank you very much for duplicating my quandary regarding the radical change in LRH. Your doing so made it less “significant”. This is a great example of one of the basic principles LRH discovered (in his better days) – i.e. the magic of communication. Specifically, in this case, duplication and understanding – in other words, an acknowledgement! A good ack all by itself can put things in perspective. I never cease to be amazed at the practical wisdom in just one small part of the large body of knowledge in Scientology.

        Thanks too for sharing your own views. You wrote: “LRH mistakenly thought that he had handled the ‘hidden influence’ issue with NOTs, and he was taken by the same powers he was trying to fight as he apparently wasn’t aware of them.”

        As I mentioned in the previous post, there have been many people in the distant past on up to the present who speak of “hidden influences”, either cabals right here among the people of Earth, or influences from elsewhere – or both (and, as you know, LRH talked about both of these). I leave my mind open to these possibilities and also to the idea that LRH was ultimately a human being. Even though he was bigger than life in genius and “star-high goals” as well as in personal flaws that came to the fore, possibly because of negative entities or for other reasons,

        I’ll post below a very short video where consciousness researcher Tom Campbell talks about “negative entities” – which he says can be either physical or non-physical. Watch the last couple of minutes, starting at 6:00, where Campbell answers a question about negative entities. Basically, he says they do exist but that we are mostly left alone, and that most negative thoughts are just ours. In other words, they are a reflection of ourselves. This is similar to what LRH says about overts and withholds, and about PTSes – that they have overts on the SP.

        Another possible explanation for LRH’s turnabout is what Campbell says will happen if you’re a positive person but are in a position of power or authority, in which case you are likely to attract negative influences who want to use your authority in a way that creates chaos and difficulty. In other words, they want to use your authority “with ego” for negative purposes (which, to my understanding, means the ego gets rather magnified). Campbell says the negative entities select out and push on people who have LEVERAGE. I think this is very much like your idea, Peter, as regards what happened to LRH.

        Thanks for your other thoughts also. And more power to you in your endeavors. 🙂

        ARC,
        marildi

      • Your are most welcome , Marildi ; I’ll look into Campbell’s video , thank you. I am going to let you in into my theory of it all regarding this subject , and I hope that I don’t spook anyone , or end up sounding too delusional.  :-))) Here I go : It is a very well known datum for us scientologists ( or ex(es) ) , that Earth has been a “dumping ground” since time immemorial (75M give or take a few millennia). Look at it this way : Humans have achieved an incredible advance in the Sciences. Since the discovery of the electricity , and specifically , the isolation of its laws and mathematical descriptions (Maxwell equations , the work of Tesla on alternating currents for i.e.) , technological advances gave a gigantic leap to the culture of Earth. We now control satellites , advance computing , artificial intelligence , international comms , deep space telescopes , etc.

        Now , just in our planetary-star system , the “Milky Way” , are billions  of stars (from 100-400). The current estimate of observable galaxies in this universe is around 100 billion. That’s  just to have a datum of comparable magnitude , and the correct estimation of effort. And with all our advances, humans have not been able to find any “evidence” of extraterrestrial life ? No signs at all ? That’s just scientifically impossible. The mathematical odds of that are like 1/1,000,000 , and I am just being conservative. We humans are so self-centered , that we think we are VERY special and rather unique : that perhaps we ARE really alone , and that we are the almighty creation of a human-like god. ( Gee , we are so self-centered that we even give “God” human-like attributes ; how can an all encompassing beingness is able has any “human” attributes just escapes my understanding). So when LRH talks about how Earth is actually a “prison planet” , totally controlled by “hidden influences” , and insidiously kept oblivious of the existence of extraterrestrial life , I am not mystified at all , then. It is even a sound hypothesis , that the reason humans have not found any evidence of life in outer space , is because they have been effectively prevented from doing so by exterior and unknown powers. Now , if they are working so hard to keep us unaware , then it is logical to assume that they are somehow monitoring us electronically and “theta-wise” as well. Therefore , they will attempt to prevent the development of any Tech with the potential to wake humans up. And what would be the target to attack from a point of view of “military strategy” ? The creator of such technology , of course. That’s what I would do ; cut the head , and the rest will go too ; exactly what is happening in PT. I would also put , if I were a “General” , an infiltrated operative to deviate the original course of action , as a “back-up plan”. The best Military weapon is not arms of mass destruction ; it is the insidious debilitation of our enemies by creating 3P effects that will effectively get them to destroy each other. This was a tactic widely used in medieval times.  In recent events in  astrophysics , some strange objects and unexplained light manifestations has been observed. There are plans in the making to explore Mars “again”. We are getting  close enough , and advanced enough so as to render old-tactics obsolete. Soon , they’ll have to decide how exactly to handle the “Teegeack issue”.

        Is anyone aware how the “Middle east Conflict” has been escalating lately ? How have we been having climate disturbances as never before ? (heavy snow storms , tsunamis , earthquakes , unusual “El Niño” phenomena). How the global economy has been deteriorating forcing others to contemplate a new “World Order” ? I really hope that my worse fears never materialize , and that my perceptions be just the result of my delusional mind. I was born with a gift , or rather a curse (still haven’t decide which way to go) ; I strongly resist being channeled by others , as I do not understand what the hell is happening to me. Will I end up with the same fate as CBR and “The Pilot” ? I sincerely hope not. I sometimes wish to just let go and just be a normal guy. To just find a soul-mate , have a mortgage , a car , a dog , and kids running around ; a stable job. But it seems that those are goals never meant for me. I am destined for something I don’t even want to confront ; and  I am trying to find all the obvious reasons why it can’t just be. I just want it to be  a delusion , a dream.

        Anyway , I think we are at risk , and that the obvious sol to that lies in researching a way to really go full OT. We do not need to “Clear Earth” ; that was always the wrong target to handle. What we do need is enough of those full OTs (20 ? , 40 ? ) to buy us time ; the rest will just follows. We need a few “Loyal Officers” desperately. So there you have it , the delusional Thetaclear.ARC,Peter

      • thetaclear: “I really hope that my worse fears never materialize, and that my perceptions be just the result of my delusional mind.”

        Peter, if you are delusional, then so are a growing number of very bright people on this planet, who are also speaking out about their perceptions and observations – which are very much in alignment, one with the other, and with you.

        “Coincidentally” (although there probably isn’t any such thing), the first video I posted above, with David Wilcock, is part 1 of a 4-part series (I’ve only watched the first 2 so far) in which he talks about almost everything you mentioned in the above comment. Also, here’s a link to one of the articles on Wilcock’s website that I read a few months ago. It also speaks directly to your post: http://divinecosmos.com/start-here/davids-blog/1170-cabal-defeat

        Btw, as I mentioned on a previous BIC thread, a fellow South African of yours posts under the name “ashanti” on David St. Lawrence’s forum. She keeps the forum updated on people and news in the “delusional” category. 😉 She’s a dedicated student and researcher of such things and stated that Wilcock is “currently ‘top dog’ in the alternative Spiritual/Truth community.”

        When I read your post, I couldn’t help but think you need terminals of comparable insight and purposes. Wilcock might be the one or somebody else, but I do think some “guardian angel” may be trying to point you in the direction of like-minded people.

        I really thank you for your bravely open communication. ❤

        ARC,
        marildi

        p.s. Here's the link to Wilcock's youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/davidwilcock333

        The video below is about ETs and Wilcock's 2015 predictions – which will raise your spirits! 🙂

      • Thanks for your kind words and encouragement , Marildi ; I really appreaciate it.

        You are right ; I need to find more of my “kind”. I am actually looking for “Applied Philosophers” (trained Scientologists who use the basic Scn principles , but totally freed of the yoke of “Authority” : Free Thinkers) with developed “theta perceptics” (psychic abilities for lack of a more accurate name). The Game ? : not suitable for blogs.

        And you are right about the “Gauardian Angel” too ; I’ve been saved from danger in this lifetime , more times than I can remember. At first I wasn’t very much aware of it ; then it felt like “intuitions” ; then like “projected concepts” ; then very clearly like projected concepts from a distinct beingness separated from myself. But at this more obvious stage , I strongly resist putting any comm line in : I just don’t want to find out. I know that I very much can put that comm line in (much better than with NOTs technique) , but I don’t feel ready yet. It feels like there are just too many waiting to make contact (including some dead friends and family) , and it is a responsibility I am not ready to carry around. But I am making preparations to learn to deal with it already.

        Anyway, thanks for your encouraging words.

        ARC, PETER

      • Peter, I’m glad that my words were encouraging. I also hope you watch those videos and look into the websites I posted the links for – they have very like-minded people.

        And listen to your Guardian Angel. I’m sure you’ll come to know what’s right for you – simply because you intend to know. 😉

      • Thanks for the comm, Marildi.

        I will certainly watch those videos and take a good look at the websites you referred to ; thank you. And will definitively put a comm line in with the “awakened ones”. :-))))

        Take care.

        ARC, PETER

      • Perfect way to phrase it, Peter – “the awakened ones”.

        You take care too!

        ARC,
        marildi

      • p.p.s.
        Peter, on the video above, start by putting your cursor at about 5:00, because the first 5 minutes are just chatting. But then they get right into the same things you are talking about – and David is very good about documenting evidence for these things.

  8. Interesting article. Thanks for your thoughts. I personally think everyone may have a different reason for their involvement in Scientology. It was never my goal to go clear or OT. I planned to leave after a drug rundown. Went clear by accident. Got involved with the OT levels after 9/11 as I realized I had some other issues to address. Didn’t really have a goal to attain anything, just wanted to know.

    Got involved with the Sea Org after a 2d bust up. So upset I didn’t want to live for myself. Figured I should at least live to help others. It was a stepping stone to getting over my loss. Although if I had not been involved in Scientology, I would not have ended the 2d. Still friends with that guy. Looking back, I have to admit I did the right thing by ending it. At least, I tell myself that. It makes me feel better. And I have reasons now, to believe.

    In the long run people think getting involved will solve some problem. That is what I have come to find out. You write: “Per LRH, what you and I and real Scientologists are going for is to become OT. This means to have super abilities, super powers, super perceptions, awareness, knowingness.” Those were never goals or purposes for me, and I think, not for everyone. As you can see, many people have not become more able, more aware, more anything except more of a victim. Which they were when they walked in the front door of Scientology.

    I have placed a lot of accountability on David Miscavige over the years, and rightly so. For the condition of the Church and the people in it. But he would be nothing without the support from others. Nothing. I helped make him what he is. So did everyone else. Of course, I did it unwittingly. But I have to own that don’t I? I had “faith”. I “trusted”.

    And if I didn’t have problems of my own, I would not have signed up for the HQS course. You don’t read much about why people fall into this from the get go.

    I am glad I did,for sure. I still read. I still think. I am still grateful for what I have learned and how I have lived. David Miscavige will never take that away from me. Neither will any Church or Holy man or teacher or magician. Or pressure group or person.

    The best thing I learned from Scientology is that it is on me, to learn, to know, to make myself happy, to solve my own problems, and to own my own life. I do not think I would have learned that early in my time somewhere else. Now, of course, it is the talk everywhere. In every self help group. By every coach.

    I’ve been down in the trenches long enough to know though, that if a person has the purpose to go south, nothing can stand in their way or interfere with that. And it doesn’t matter what group they are in. What religion they are in. Or what degree or certificate they have.

    Many people have used Scientology to harm themselves. And to harm others. They would have twisted the Pope to the same end. They would have found another path to abuse themselves and others.

    I just read someplace, that someone was “forced to have six abortions” in the Church. I mean, after the first, if it had been possible for someone to force me to have an abortion, I would have closed my legs. How do you “force”this? She was not forced to have sex, but she was forced to abort. Getting laid at the expense of a human life? And how do you force the abortion? By telling someone they will have to relocate, or provide for themselves? I mean, if that forces you into murdering you own child, you do have problems maybe bigger than you knew.

    Whew!

    You know, I am just trying to keep it real here. The Church attracted a lot of NEEDY people. A lot of BROKEN and UNHAPPY people. It could not fix them or did not fix them. The Church PROFITS off other people’s misery. People that come and pay to be helped want help with their burdens. And the Church made them miserable just like every one else did. And David Miscavige used and abused them just like everyone else did.

    Yes, it is very unholy.But we learn from this, a person really has to help them self.

    One of the worst attacks I have had in conversations on the Internet, from a person was,”You just can’t help yourself.” That was a hopeful wish.

    Many people think they can not help them self. That is why they go into the Church of Scientology to begin with.

    I had to help myself every step of the way. I had to help myself. And it was a lot easier than helping others.

    Why is it so easy for people to help others, but not them self? You see people that spent years on staff helping others, never them self.

    At the end of the day, David Miscavige banks on people that will not help them self, and instead, he uses them to “help others” all the while failing at even that.

    Yes, that is a suppression. He sets everyone up for a loss.

    But, if you are capable at helping yourself, you do not need him. He does not matter. Nor the other “Captains”.

    • Then, I am still heartened when I see people that stand up just because they are human, and can care about others, and they can HELP themselves and others NOT because they are profiting off of anyone’s misery. You look at Marty, Mike, Karen, the maker of this blog, I mean, these people are still helping themselves and helping others, with out taxing anyone, dominating anyone, building followings and blah blah blah.

      There is another end of this where people are real and they deserved trust and faith. And they are there to be found within a Scientology arena.

      At the end of the day, there was something Holy to experience.

      • TO – much of what you said in your comments resonates with me.

        I never came into SCN to handle anything or need of change – I was born into it and that was just the way I grew up. My parents never particularly forced it on me although they did apply basics such as making us scrapping kids confront each other until VGI’s and wondering what the hell we were fighting for in the first place. And of course the usual stats system, where we earned our pocket money by being upstat and lost it if we were misbehaving (just as is accepted standard practice in modern parenting today).

        I was allowed to attend Sunday school of other Christian religions with friends – I even got married in the Catholic Church and attended Mass on Sundays. I loved the sermons – many of them made total sense and in my mind, aligned with SCN in many ways! And I also had a relationship with a Jewish guy, happily adjusted to his family’s way of life and did what was necessary for me to be accepted into their circle. That was yet another positive aspect I got from SCN – having done the Ministers Course and studying other religions, I gained a genuine tolerance, understanding, ARC for and willingness to grant others’ rights to their own beliefs.

        My personal intention with SCN was always a 3rd & 4th dynamic thrust. I wanted to help others. I did the early (LRH version) HQS Course in the mid-70’s (not the butchered DM version) and I consider this action alone set me up for handling future life. I had some other training here and there, and I served on staff, both in the GO and more recently in JBG Org. I was a dedicated, involved and active SCN on and off throughout my life and particularly for the 14 years preceding my declare which came about as a result of me spotting the myriad outpoints and refusing to shut-up – I had the integrity to say what I observed, and got nailed. C’est la vie.

        I too had this consideration (and particularly of late) of SCN attracting the NEEDY – People that were somehow broken in some area of life and needing fixing. I never had a problem with this, but in later years I started seeing more and more SCN positioning itself as a “fix me up” or “rehabilitation” activity, which somewhat flew in the teeth of LRH stating that SCN made the able more able. I had a problem with “Stress Tests”. Virtually 90% of people attracted to the book stands thought they were getting blood-pressure tests – and when holding the cans, I could SEE the MU’s flying. 90% of these people would NEVER read the book – they simply were not capable of doing so. I never agreed with this, as I felt it was in a way “false advertising” and thus a false-stat. I much preferred the previous marketing angle of “you only use 10% of your mind/brain – unleash the rest”. This tag-line, in my view, would attract those who were already somewhat spiritually aware and looking for answers to improve themselves.

        The other day I drove past our local Org, and saw DMSMH banners running right down the length of the building – visible from the street, but all of them slanted to life’s ailments instead of abilities to be gained – again, IMO totally the wrong message. What kind of people are going to be attracted with “buttons” such as “stressed?” “Depressed?”, “Marriage Problems?” and the like – this attracts people who are at total effect rather than cause, and it positions SCN as some kind of Psychiatric help facility. I know – I was the PES and a very active FSM and I witnessed what came through the org doors in recent years. This is a polar opposite to the Old-Timers of early years who all seemed to be pretty jacked up, able people – literate, could study well, became excellent auditors and went up the bridge pronto – and right now in PT, ALL of these people are doing very well – and interestingly, most of them declared or out. Too aware for their own good, perhaps?

        Instead, now the scene is guys milling around on and off div6 lines for months on end, unable to afford the bridge, let alone duplicate the higher tech. These guys don’t want to study SCN – they are effect, and “want to be fixed up”. Unable to pull themselves up by the bootstraps enough to “become more able”. All these people became good for is “fodder” – recruited onto staff (and inevitably blowing through massive accumulated MU’s, thus further destabilising the org). None or very few of them at best actually “making it” in SCN – but attending fundraisers and trying to make a name for themselves with “donor status” (the not-so-bright have a HUGE self-importance button, so “status” would be something that really appeals). And so the treadmill begins – donating money, putting themselves in the gutter, being hauled out and briefly dusted off so that they can further earn money which they give to Ideal Morgues, IAS etc. And of course putting enormous strain on org and exec lines with ENDLESS “problems”, thereby sucking the attention onto them and off the upstats who paid for services yet are relegated to the back of the queue because they’re not screaming, moaning and dramatising. The squeaky wheel is the one who gets the oil!

        And the end result? The majority of these people are no longer around. When the ED of our org stood up at one event and announced that over 1,800 people had been introduced to SCN since JBG Org went Ideal, I looked around the room at the 30 people in attendance and thought to myself “where the hell ARE these 1800 people?” And the 30 people I saw were old-timers – people who, like me, had been around for ages. (This was not to last though).

        On the OT levels, I too had no burning desire to rush up the bridge to OT – was never my game, and I particularly became averse to it when I witnessed OT’s returning from AO’s all bright and shiny for a while only to crash and burn badly – and I mean as in worse off than before. I saw chronic body ailments, MAJOR financial crises, 2D’s breaking up, husbands beating their wives, a close friend left brain damaged from a motorbike accident, yet another OT7 stabbed to death, another dying from AIDS, OT’s losing their jobs or company’s they owned going bankrupt. But the worst was those who, in an attempt to “keep up the OT façade”, resorted to criminal activities to rake in more money – borrowing from friends and family and not paying it back, creating Ponzi schemes, getting involved in illicit diamond deals and the like – all of which placed not only them but many others at severe risk of utter ruin.

        And their solution? GO BACK TO THE AO!!! I could never get my head around this……….. and can’t help but wonder if this is not some devious grand design. Give the guy “just enough” to think he’s had a major case win, but not enough for this to be stable, ensuring he will screw-up and have to return again and again to “fix things up” when life goes wonky (which it invariably does). This turn-style activity of failing OT’s returning again and again to AO’s is lucrative business, and it further obfuscates the fact that not many NEW OT’s are being made. Just a thought.

        IMO, we now sit with a situation of any OT or SCN truly worth their salt and having really attained the ability to “think freely”, LOOK (not listen) and observe what is in front of their noses – all of them have left the Church. And all of them are doing well – whether they have left the subject entirely, decided to carry on outside of the Church or have joined the whistle-blowers. And THIS is what drives DM stark-raving crazy. He KNOWS that the REALLY able and powerful guys are OUT and are now pushing back. The jig is up, and he’s on a slippery slope to oblivion. Nothing quite as vicious as a corned rat.

        It’s just a matter of time.

      • Wow Shelly, You certainly hit the nail ON THE HEAD! Especially with the advertising. You get what you demand. Hubbard himself said it. Name, want get. What do they advertise for? “Are you failing in life? Are you overwhelmed”? They ask perfectly healthy and happy people what their ruin is, because it’s tradition. The sup power rundowns were developed for RPF repair. Now being delivered to the most able and successful public.

        I worked at the Flag Land Base for six years. Was 99% on public lines. The most able were the people coming in from Narconon Italy. Yet they were considered “DB’s” and were relegated to training cycles before they could do the OT levels. None of the staff wanted anything to do with them. Just stupid. All of those young people had picked themselves up by the boot straps, made it go right to live at Flag full time. Trained to be auditors. And you had all of these”squeaky clean” Sea Org Members living on the welfare of the Church, snubbing their noses at them. It was insane.

        The V.I.P. wealthy public, do not even want to tell you some of stories as to how some of them came into their wealth. Well, they were nice to me. I don’t forget things like that.

        The real zinger of your post, “Give the guy “just enough” to think he’s had a major case win, but not enough for this to be stable, ensuring he will screw-up and have to return again and again to “fix things up” when life goes wonky (which it invariably does).” There is so much truth to this. I realized at one point of the bridge, the bridge as it is, is missing many pieces and flows.

        For instance, on L12 one handles OP TERMS. But after a person has done that, they should run the opposite. CO TERMS. You should always run the other flows or your flows get lopsided. I have found it is frequently the opposite of what I am running, where the most charge is.

        When you run overts, the flows are always what you have done to others. One flow. Should be all four flows. There is rightness in every overt, that is never taken up. What problem were you trying to solve? Rehab the person’s problem solving abilities. What problem were they trying to solve? See the rightness in others.

        Hubbard never wrote anywhere that he “told all”. And I think he did not.

        But if you go figuring these things out for yourself, you get labeled a squirrel. Even thought it becomes very obvious when you take on the hat of resolving your own case.

        And this “squirrel” label, you know it leads into the core of evil in the Church.

        I am all for ethics, it is math. Greatest good for the greatest number of YOUR dynamics. Not someone else’s!!!! You see then, how out ethics the Church is. The ethics system there insists that you do the greatest good for the CHURCH’S dynamics.

        So, this puts a person in the position of having to have approval from EVERYONE in the Church. ONE disapproval voiced in a KR and you are ethics bait. It keeps people in the tone level of needing approval. Approval from bodies. And if you don’t hang on that, your membership can be revoked. It socks people into a GPM.

        You know, Scientology is all about the CONVERSATIONS. These recommended conversations Hubbard laid on the table. Conversations are used in every psycho therapy in the world. Conversations can harm or heal. People that attack through conversation, are not healers. They just are not.

        People can attack what the Church of Scientology has become, that is easy.

        But the auditing? Seriously? If this healing method disturbs one, one must take it all down. Every therapy on the planet revolving around a conversation.

        The only treasure the Church possessed, was the recommended conversations.

        That is out on the streets. People are free to have any conversation they wish. The advises on those conversations, is all over the Internet.

        All a person needs anymore, at the end of the day, is someone who is interested enough to ask them a question.

        It may sound simple but this in itself is huge magic.

        Why are we blank slates until someone asks us a question? Why is it we do not know what we know, until someone asks us?

        Am I the only one who thinks about these things?

    • This is a very touching and moving comment, TO. Thank you for it. I have read other comments you have made on this and other blogs and they were always very thoughtful and thought-provoking. And I didn’t know you are a woman. I had this picture until now of you as a man (hope that doesn’t offend you).

      Thanks again.

      • Thank you for your kind acknowledgement Morris. No, everyone is usually surprised to find out I am a woman. On a forum. One person from a forum traveled all the way from upstate New York to a Freezone event on the West Coast to meet me, very upset to find me in a Diane Von Furstenberg Dress with Georgia Armani stockings and six inch heels.

        There is really nothing masculine about me except that I collect handguns. But I have a pink nano Beretta. I think it just must have something to do with the way I talk. I was raised by men, my grandfather, his brothers, one son in law. I just grew up only having conversations with men. My grandfather was the power in the family, and you had about 60 seconds to get your point across to him. We all got very forthcoming very fast.

      • And my best wishes to you Peter. Your lack of self importance comes through in your posts on the forums. Always pushing someone else up. You have helped me by setting a very good example of granting beingness. XXOO

      • Your gentle red carpet that you lay out, so warm, helps me to admit why I am here to begin with.

      • This will probably get posted above your post, Oracle, but it is meant as a reply to it :

        Thanks for your kind words Oracle ; you are most welcome. :-)))

        ARC, PETER

  9. Nice post. Having been in the Hell Hole (Sea Org) from the age age of 14-38, I have a lot of mixed emotions about David Miscavide and Ron Hubbard. I was on the Apollo in 1975 and I spend\t 4-5 days down in the chain locker at the age of 15.

    I am not going to spill that it was horrible, and I was not abused, but judge for one self.

    • You mean that LRH was backing this sort of thing well before Miscavige, right?

      I have my opinions about that, which I won’t go into right now. But I still use the tech and profit by it. Whatever LRH did or didn’t do, he did develop the tech. which to me stands by itself as a separate thing. (I know that not everyone will agree with me on this.)

      • I agree Morris. LRH was no saint, He was not infallible. He made mistakes. But he also left one hell of a legacy that has benefitted and helped people greatly.

      • I , for one, very much agree with you Morris ; Tech stand by itself as a separate thing. And not knowing that Fact , as it is a fact and not an opinion at all , get others to fail to avail themselves with workabke principles and techniques that can immensely make their life better.

        LRH the individual is one thing , (and opinions varies as regards to his ulterior motives) and LRH the researcher is entirely another different thing. Fully understanding that will accomplish a very needful dissociation (as oppose to “identification”) which will get the subject of Scn to never get lost. Peter

      • +1

        I agree too, Morris. And by “tech” I would include not just auditing but training and some of the admin tech.

      • In my opinion and observation personally of the a little less than a year I spent on the Apollo while LRH was there, he was losing it. Mind you this is in hindsight, as back then he was god like. But I know for a fact that for several months I slept in the lifeboat above his research office at night (it was way too hot down below on the ship) and heard him screaming, cussing and yelling at his messengers at night. His temper got increasingly worse. Does his philosophy and tech that he developed work? Yes in a lot of cases, but wait til you see see the HBO Doc where there is footage of LRH and as Rinder pointed out it is not pretty at all. Meanwhile your facts about Dave are pretty accurate, it is a fact that he hates LRH.

    • Mreppen, reading your post broke my heart. No one deserves that!
      I hope someday, if you haven’t already, to be able to put this behind you and that the scars will heal.

  10. Thank you for sharing your thoughts Morris!

    I share some of my thoughts on why not only Miscavige – but the entire fraudulent institutional structure; the cowed / indoctrinated staff & public participants – are and were set from the word go – deliberately and with malice a forethought – within the insulated bubble-world of $cientology to do what they are doing to destroy Scientology – and at the same time willing to subject themselves to the dictatorship of Miscavige.

    To put the spotlight only on Miscavige is a bit short-sighted .

    Fundamentally – this cult set-up and resultant actions of $cientologists are based in deep-seated and un-inspected fears and beliefs – HOOKS – known as fixed ‘stable datums.’ I will only mention one of them.

    1. $cientologists will tell you – ‘they know what they know’ – a world-view where life, the universe and everything is entirely based on what $cientology via Miscavige; his SO- and other minions; the fraudulent institutional structures; the twisted, omitted and perverted Hubbard teachings are used as ‘stable datums’ – HOOKS – to allow $cientologists to ‘know what they know’.

    2. Yes – they are also indoctrinated to flow adulation, admiration, power, money, to the all-knowing, benevolent, self-appointed Pope of $cientology – the saviour of all that is with an almighty ‘ethics presence’. (Read that to mean psychopathic presence). Can they see that David Miscavige is a living, textbook example of a psychopath? Nope. They only ‘know what they know’. Will they do research on the internet, read one unapproved book, ask inconvenient questions, or talk to a so called SP – even one that they might have known for 35 years? Nope. They wilfully ‘know what they know.’

    3. For anyone to still believe that David Miscavige is so evil, so ALL POWERFUL, so intelligent, so cunning – that he ALONE is responsible for the destruction of the church of Scientology and all that it stands for – must surely still be under some sort of spell, or did not do his or her homework. No, he has thousands of helpers who ‘know what they know.’ Besides, as someone said, he can’t be responsible for all the evil in the world. That is Monsanto’s job. 😉

    If one is no longer one of Miscavige’s helpers, may I ask to please give due attention and consideration to the following – meant for so called SPees, aka practising Scientologists, or even those who no longer refer to themselves as Scientologists – but who in the past had a hand in getting someone entrapped onto the circular Bridge of $cientology – people who now only ‘know what they know’ helping Miscavige to destroy Scientology. I have a few questions to ask.

    1. Do you still believe that ‘shame, blame, and regret’ – (let me add a few human emotions not mentioned on the tone scale) – compassion, empathy and a heart of stone – is the way to go?

    2. How many people are you responsible for having put onto the circular Bridge in $cientology – those who are still trapped there, ‘knowing what they know’ – still going around and around….?

    3. How many children do you know of or are responsible for – for having disconnected from their father or mother?

    4. How many marriages did you help break up – for the greatest good of one spouse aka the greatest good of $cientology? (Read that the mean in favour of the one in control of the bank balance.)

    5. How many children did you see go without an education – child slaves on staff – and did nothing about it?

    6. How many people did you have a hand in making that person compromise their own integrity, or forced them in one way or the other to sign pieces of paper to deceive them, or to do as you dictated – ‘or else’?

    7. How many people did you convince to go into debt, to max out credit cards, to cash in pensions or education funds, inheritances, driven into poverty – to give away this money to $cientology / IAS / Idle Orgs etc. to satisfy David Miscavige’s greed and fuel his insatiable desire for glitz glamour money?

    8. How many people did you have a hand in driving over the edge by ‘gang bang’ checks; or being overwhelmed with black Dianetics; or participated in interrogations; or just being part of a group (gang) to get that person to comply – whereby such a preponderance of actions over time – eventually drove the person over the edge into insanity?

    I am sure that most practising-, escaped- or declared Scientologists were not personally damaged by the experience – perhaps only suffered from a diminished bank balance.

    However, consider that others were not as fortunate, and on a gradient scale from slight damage to extreme damage – there are real living and breathing people out there – irrevocably damaged at the receiving end of David Miscavige’s minions.

    If one is no longer under the spell of Miscavige – one is allowed to think about these things. Allowed to reach out to such people. Allowed to ask to be forgiven for such actions. Allowed to make up the damage. And if one has clean hands – it would go a long way to salvage Scientology, to do so. AND DON’T JUSTIFY SUCH PAST ATROCITIES TO SAY ‘YOU WERE ACTING ON ORDERS!!!’ You are no longer subject to orders. On the outside – one is only subject to the dictates of one’s own conscience.

    I would like to take this opportunity to thank Shelly publicly for having been some comfort to my disabled daughter – who was eventually driven into insanity. It was a slow death of reason that took 21 years to accomplish in the hands of the Miscavige minions of $cientology. Shelly herself was still in the cult at the time – but had enough humanity intact – to reach out to try to comfort her, when she observed that a fellow human being was being victimised.

    Thank you Shelly.

    I wonder if there is any practising Scientologist who can ever put together again – a shattered mind…? If so, please let me know. It is unfathomable what was done to her.

    • Yikes ! Moderator if you are going to publish this then – please don’t publish this with this mistake. It should read ‘un-inspected’ – not ‘inspected’ here is the sentence to be corrected. ‘Fundamentally – this cult set-up and resultant actions of $cientologists are based in deep-seated and un-inspected ……

    • Jane, thanks very much for the ack. I just could not stand by and watch Janine being treated as she was. It was abominable in the extreme, and it was one of the catalysts resulting in me waking up and realising just how criminal my “religion” (read cult) had become. The scales fell from my eyes seeing hers and other cycles go down.

      And as for the church supporting, aiding and abetting Ian Nel in his kidnapping of their daughter and annihilation of Janine while he was feathering another nest and making babies with someone else while still married – well, I have no words. He should join the SO. He would be in good company.

      Please read Theta Clear’s post above about a submission to the Human Right’s Commission. Perhaps you could get in comm with him on this. Janine’s story deserves to be heard.

      Please give Janine my love. I truly do hope and pray that she can once again find happiness and peace of mind.

  11. I am so enjoying the various comments and points of view coming out here. Much to think on… But for sure while Miscavige is doing bad stuff he has capitalised on pre – existing LRH and Scientology practises and policies and continues the tradition. I do feel he has greatly upped the level of abuse however.
    With LRH I may have enjoyed the thrills of over boarding, chain locker, and a holiday in the bilges. But when it was over I was back on post hoping to hell it didn’t happen again. Oh and of course the crows nest. This is not for someone scared of heights. These days guys go into the hole and are still there. I almost want to say I hope they are, because where else are they? Dead maybe?

    • I have thought a lot about your last point also, LMR. Mike, Marty and Debbie were strong and found a way to get out. And Marc and Claire and some others. The ones who are still in (either the Hole or just the SO at Int) I would imagine have compromised their reality to such a degree, and have been so PTS for so long, that they really may be “too far gone” to salvage, and the best thing for them might be to “move on”.

      But let’s say Miscavige is gone, and they are all finally free of him. Would you want any one of them to be some sort of leader in the “new” Scientology? I certainly would not. I would not under any circumstances want them in control of anything in a new Scientology. I think that they are so compromised as beings that it will take a LONG time before they are rehabilitated as spiritual beings, or even human beings. (No relation here to the RPF, by the way).

      Just some thoughts.

      • Yup. I am not saying we should re – instate them as leaders or management . I believe they are or were so broken that they are no longer fully functional. And even though it could be argued they had to agree to their situation to some degree for it to persist, they are now in a situation where they need help and rescue. Food, sleep, safe environment and probably the general PAB6 handling initially. And a trip to the doctor and dentist is a little overdue.
        Mike, Marty and Marc all got out through ingenuity and guts. They had to overcome danger and fear but made it. Some of the others in there are likely not as strong as they were, not to mention a decade or 2 older.
        I am sure that in their day they contributed greatly and suffered through SO life. They deserve rescue and repair. This repair is available to them outside of the Church.
        Oh and the last thing anybody needs now is a new Church of Scientology or Church of anything for that matter. For me it is enough to know that the tech is alive and well outside the suppressive confines of a sick and dysfunctional dying group of blind moronic robots incapable of seeing anything but the next stat report.

      • Hi LMR,

        You have a compassionate viewpoint which makes me look kind of mean here. But you are right on all your points. We definitely don’t want another church of any kind. And those still in now, when they are finally free of the suppression, should be helped and rescued and fixed up. That they may have been weaker – or older, which is a very good point – doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t be helped and fixed up.

      • That’s a great viewpoint Morris!

        They definitively need to be patched up, rehabilitated , and helped in recovering their self-respect. We should never imitate the CofS in their punitive approach to ethics and justice. We are auditors to the world, not judges or jurors.

        Even if many of them succumbed to invitations to harass , and to unwittingly or otherwise suppress others , still we should teach them by example and not in any way with hate, misemotion , criticism or reproaches.

        Only in learning to love our fellows in spite of their weaknesses and failings, can any true freedom be found. But we should never do it to procure “salvation” , but only because it is the honorable thing to do.

        ARC, PETER

      • Morris, Thank you for your straight-talking presentation – very refreshing 🙂

        Perhaps we may also take into account, that very special attribute, which makes for great leadership, in the broadest sense possible! — “balance”

        IMHO, GREAT leaders, in addition to their ability to “get things done”, are often remembered more fondly, because they generally showed “compassion,” in abundance. Using that yardstick, one is thus quickly able to discern whether a candidate, is deserving of such a title.

        Gandhi, Mother Theresa, Nelson Mandela, Princess Diana, Dalais Lama, and of course, Jesus Christ, are just some who come to mind, as having served others with abiding compassion and selflessness.

        And the amazing thing about them all? — they also had other qualities in common — love and humility! 🙂

        – Calvin.

        .

  12. I would not assume your stated three “facts” are indeed factual.

    I think its very easy to assume DM is an SP. Based on data from various sources, the man appears to be rather unpleasant. But, whether or not he is an anti-social personality is anyone’s guess. This needs to be distinguished from Suppressive Person, which effectively is someone who is anti-management or anti-Scn.

    It would not surprise me that DM considers himself to be a true-blue, hardcore Scnist, carrying on the work of LRH. His violence and aggression and abuse of power can be somewhat laid at the doorstep of the Sea Org culture.

    We can, however, judge him on the state of organised Scn after 30 years of rule. It is generally agreed that membership is dwindling, that orgs are barely surviving, let alone expanding. The overall landscape of Scn is probably in worse shape than before he took charge. So, in this regard, we can state that he is a bad manager or a poor leader. As well, his ability to analyse data and discover the underlying causes to Scn’s decline are observably inadequate.

    If we want to talk about OT abilities or super-human powers, let us not forget that DM is mid-OTVII. I have a hard time reconciling this. Sure we can come up with all sorts of justifications of how this is possible, but remember this is the head of RTC, the body responsible for the standardness of the tech. We would not be wrong to assume his Bridge is about as standard as standard can get. This should call into question the state of the technology over the past 30 years.

    • Hi statpush. your points are well taken. Also of relevance, is the fact that Deah Leadah, has pointedly REFUSED auditing for the past 30 odd years!

      IMHO, that single issue, compared to LRH’s regular fall-back to regular and trusted auditing, should spell out sufficiently and clearly, whether he, DM, should EVER HAVE BEEN TRUSTED, in ANY of his directives regarding Scn.

      “Clean hands make for a happy life!” — What sane, trustworthy person would disagree with that statement?

      • Re: Refusing Auditing – again, under Scn’s own policy/tech this is a red flag. I believe Marty once said that DM hadn’t been on The Level or in-session since the early 90s. To me this indicates a couple of possibilities:
        1) The gain or benefit DM received from auditing on VII was not sufficient to compel him to continue.
        2) He did something wrong on The Level which is preventing his case from moving forward.
        3) He’s completed the level (had to include this as a possibility).
        4) Never should have been on the level in the first place.

        All of this is speculation, but it’s entertaining. Any one of these does reflect well on RTC and their ability to standardly apply the tech. None of this is terribly surprising really. I’ve often wondered if individuals at the highest echelons of Scn management were even Scnists, given their behavior and lack of application of Scn.

        And certainly DM does not have clean hands. But why would his comrades allow him to remain in power and inflict such harm? Not an easy question to answer given the insular, cult-like environment.

        That said, I think it is very superficial to attribute all of Scn’s woes to DM. What about the hundreds of grown men and women at the Int Base, who allow this to occur? How can this multitude of intelligent, able individuals be so dumb? The Int Base was not solely created by DM, many, many others worked to create such a culture, which may or may not have been based on LRH policy or advices.

        Nevertheless, this represents the pinnacle of Scn third dynamic. Something is seriously, seriously wrong with that picture.

      • Yep, well written account there statpush. Plenty of sound data to back it too.

        However, lest we miss the main points I was trying to bring to your attention in the three above sentences, I ask again that you look squarely at them.

        To really get the message, I believe it is absolutely necessary, to crank up one’s confront of ‘evil’. It is just too easy to dismiss what (who) one is dealing with, unless one has truly inspected for the depths of evil contained within the individual in question.

        To further emphasize the point, I suggest one looks into the lives of the most feared, cruel dictators in history. All have many traits in common, but the most dominant trait, can only be described as “unimaginably evil.”

        Indeed, because the average person does not easily ‘imagine’, such depravity, this “truth” is beyond their acceptance level (that is,until they have experienced it first hand.) Only then, does stark reality hit them.. It need not take such an experience, to wake up to the actuality. But it certainly DOES require that one confronts the FACT of evil, fully recognizing it for what it is and thus be better enabled to put situations, and their cause, into proper perspective.

        Perhaps, this is a huge ‘mitigating’ factor, in the apparent blindness of the flocks of $heeple, unwittingly being led to their $laughter.

        A battle hardened 2c.

      • Racing, in response to your posting…

        “Also of relevance, is the fact that Deah Leadah, has pointedly REFUSED auditing for the past 30 odd years!”
        As I noted, within Scn this is a red flag and a bad indicator. On a side note, towards the end of my involvement with Scn I too refused auditing, in fact, I probably will never again pick up the cans.

        “IMHO, that single issue, compared to LRH’s regular fall-back to regular and trusted auditing, should spell out sufficiently and clearly, whether he, DM, should EVER HAVE BEEN TRUSTED, in ANY of his directives regarding Scn.”
        I think DM had already assumed power before this occurred. All I know is that at one time (early to mid 90s I believe) he was auditing on OTVII, then stopped. But even back in the early to mid 80s DM was a force to be reckoned with. When LRH died, he simply seized control, and the rest is history. I think we also need to put things in context. The Sea Org environment and life is much different than anywhere else. They often are harsh and abusive. So, it’s much easier for a personality like DM to blend in.

        “Clean hands make for a happy life!” — What sane, trustworthy person would disagree with that statement?
        I agree with this statement.

    • Come on Statpush! I like a lot of your comments. But on the question of whether or not Miscavige is an SP, well, why don’t we also do an evaluation of Adolf Hitler’s actions to see if he really was an SP or not. Some things are too obvious, and one of these is that Miscavige is an SP.

      • Morris,
        You know, myself and many others on this blog, have objected to the church’s mislabelling and false SP declares, and rightly so. The church for some time has ceased following its own technology and policy in this area. Today’s SPs are mainly anti-management; they are NOT anti-social personalities. In all my 30 years I NEVER seen an MAA or EO run through the list of social/anti-social personalities to determine if a person is a real SP.
        So, why should we make the same mistake with DM? Because he’s an asshole? Because he’s arrogant and narcissistic? Because he’s a bully? Because he issues orders (sometimes destructive) and people follow them?
        Trust me, I am no fan of DM and Scn would be better off without him. I say this based on the state of Scn, not based on the 12 characteristics of an SP. Things have gotten worse since he’s assumed command. And that is as far as I’ll go in condemning the man.
        Have you met DM? Spent any time with him? Witnessed him committing some suppressive act? Have you witnessed him do anything positive? Has there been ANY positive change in Scn since he’s been running the show?
        Comparisons with Hitler are not productive. Hitler was a pro, DM is merely a punk 🙂

  13. We do know what is wrong with the church. Behind DM there might be some Sherman Tanks…. I wouldn’t be surprised. As a matter of fact, “Scientology” (the DM version) suits any government to be the future religion of the world. A no or all gods religion which is right now being prepared so as to fit the current governing system: docile people with new views on religion to gather the masses and put them under control once again. I don’t know how they are going to deal with the Thetan issue but I am sure they could find a way.

    Meanwhile, we in the Independent field we have local revolts and local groups not orgs really with a few exceptions given that an Org has a Standard Admin System. And the Admin Tech is absent and not-ised in the Indie field. Certainly something to ponder upon.

  14. I enter the debate a bit late. I read all the post and there was some I wanted to reply but there was no reply button.
    What is nice is to read so many very inspired viewpoint. I knew Oracle was a girl, not that I read it anywhere, but i always mocked up Oracle as a girl. Young and sexy? I always think that on this blogs we are all vintage scientologists, pre Miscavige. It’s too bad to be over 60 when all your life you used to be young. The body gets heavy disfonctionnal and if you had enough shit you are also ill with something more or less chronic. And due to Miscavige greed you are sometime poor (but it’s relative, you spent it all but you made the money that you would not have made without such a pressure).
    Bad end for someone who was top of the universe. A few amongst the few.
    You will excuse my english, it looks most of the time genuine but sometime I miss the right word.
    I was quite interested by the exchange between Thetaclear and Maridli (are you a girl?).
    I used to think like you Thetaclear, conspiracy type. Miscavige is a Markabian! And so on. I thought all that since 1982. (and I had to say that I never heard of Sector 9 of Robertson before late nineties.)
    I was litterally striked by this perception. I was getting this message “we are loosing the war”.
    I was OT3 at this time. I felt and percieved the takeover of scientology without any data.
    The worst moment was the new year event 83/84. There was the message from LRH, RJ38. Well I didn’t recognize LRH’s voice, a bad imitation. Couldn’t spot the being behind the voice, and if I tried to spot the speaker, he was not a 72 years old man, but much younger. There was no comm lag, no chukle, no heavy breathing of someone over 70 who smoked all his life.
    I realize that if my perception was true, that the tape was a forgery, then scientology was done, freedom was shut. And like you, Thetaclear, I hoped I was wrong. So many time in my life I hoped to be wrong. Hopefuly many time I was, it permit me to breath and enjoy irresponsability. But sadly enough I was not wrong on this one. Something very suppressive was cooking. And the cycle is not over. We are still in it. But this was about making sure scientologists will not make it.
    You said, Thetaclear, a system of third party, yes of course.
    But I also hope it’s all blabla.But the fact that you think like me, trigger my itsa line.
    But it’s to some degree to painful due to the amount of wrongness. Maybe this perception is part of the trap. Yes it is!
    Now, about the change in character of Hubbard.
    Maybe you listened or read this great lecture. “attitude and conduct of scientology” 3 November 1955.
    He said you should never disconnect and be mean etc… If you have never read it, I have it, i can mail it. It’s the opposite of wrongs indications, it’s so right.
    10 years later he went tougher, Captain Blight valence.
    I don’t think it was hidden influence like the power push of 1982. He went just sour due to too many non compliances. Try to be in his position, he felt that he was not getting his points through and with such a bad troup he would not succeed. Maybe he was paranoid, but who is not who feel responsable.
    And he lost some of his lightness, but it doesnt impact the tech or the basic policies like the data series. Please read “anatomy of thought”, that’s Hubbard! The basic law is what’s count, not the incidental fact.
    I think this blog is really good, it really invite to communicate.

    • Hi FG,

      Thanks so much for communicating your perceptions. All you said about the suppression of scientology is entirely plausible, in my view.

      As you probably gathered from my comments, I consider there is probably truth to two basic viewpoints. There’s the one that you, thetaclear and David Wilcock all articulate so well, with regard to the various warring factions on planet Earth (involving both physical and non-physical entities).

      And there’s also the view Tom Campbell expresses, which doesn’t really conflict with the other one, except that Campbell puts more emphasis on individuals simply maintaining a sort of immunity to negative entities by remaining positive and – to put it in scn terms – in ethics. I guess in Buddhist terms, this would probably be the Noble Eightfold Path: Right view, Right intention, Right speech, Right action, Right livelihood, Right effort, Right mindfulness, Right concentration.

      Incidentally, Wilcock mentioned in that last video I posted (the one with the 2015 predictions) that both Buddha and Jesus were not originally from Earth – in other words, they were ETs who wanted to help mankind.

      In any case, I think it’s probably up to each individual to decide what part s/he wants to play – or is responsible to play – as regards the situation we find ourselves in.

      And yes, I’m a girl (an “older girl” lol). Good perception there too. 🙂

      • p.s. You mention responsibility in relation to the subject of LRH’s “about face” (his 180 degree reversal). I wish could remember the reference where he expressed the idea that for someone who is taking little responsibility there wouldn’t be much commotion around him – and yet he would give the impression of being a good guy, doing good works. By contrast, a person taking on a lot of responsibility would be likely to have a great amount of commotion going on around him, and yet he would be accomplishing a good deal. That is very much paraphrased, and LRH expressed it so much more eloquently, but it was the basic concept.

      • p.p.s. I so agree with you that this blog invites communication! And how apropos that you should mention the LRH Lecture, “Attitude and Conduct of Scientology”. I recently quoted a passage from that tape on Marty Rathbun’s blog and got a derogatory reply from him. I’m sure the quote would be much better appreciated here – bearing in mind that LRH stated this back in 1955 before his own attitude changed (or seemed to) on just about every point. Here’s the passage:

        “…the arduous lesson along this line is that no-communication lists, revocation/suspension of certificates, court action of any kind whatsoever within the realm of Scientology and so forth, is not only…not only difficult to do but does not work. That’s just the end of it. It just doesn’t work. It’s for the sea gulls.

        “That might work in Gestetner Limited or Westinghouse, but it does not work in Scientology. Got that?

        “It’s because they are people of good intention. And by saying that these people are not fit to associate with us anymore, we have told a lie of magnitude. This is not true. It’s never true. You got it?

        “Our inability to understand the actions of other scientologists has a very fascinating barrier. The limitation on our understanding is simply this: We say they have bad intentions, and that is a lie. Got it?

        “So the whole situation is liable to enturbulate around that postulated bad intention. That’s what enturbulates the situation. That makes a lie. The situation then becomes unsolvable. Because we’ve entered a changing factor called a lie into it.

        “The most valuable asset we have, actually, is our ability to understand, to do the right thing, to be kind, to be decent.

        “Well, i hate to unsettle a very stable datum, if it does unsettle it. But the only way anything ever does resolve is by letting your own kind heart reach through. That’s the only way it ever does solve. And it never solves by being tough.

        “What do we really have of value in the organizations of Scientology? The only thing we have of value, actually, is Scientology, an understanding of life, increasing ability to communicate, a good concept and grip on reality and the ability to like guys. That’s all you got.

        “And there’s only one more thing that we could know that would make us all feel very, very relaxed about the whole thing. There isn’t a person anywhere in Scientology who has bad intentions for Scientologists or their fellow man. And that point all by itself is very well worth thinking about the next time some trouble arises in your vicinity, because that is the truth. And if you handle a situation with that in mind, you will solve the situation.”

        (from “Attitude and Conduct of Scientology”, 4th London ACC, 3rd November 1955)

    • FC: ” knew Oracle was a girl, not that I read it anywhere, but i always mocked up Oracle as a girl. Young and sexy?”

      Thetaclear : Yeah , that how I always mocked her up , though not necessarily so young , but mature and interesting. :-)))

      FC : “I always think that on this blogs we are all vintage scientologists, pre Miscavige. It’s too bad to be over 60 when all your life you used to be young. The body gets heavy disfonctionnal and if you had enough shit you are also ill with something more or less chronic.”

      TC : Yeah, I know what you mean ; bodies are always sort of a Dev-T. But nothing like a having a young spirit , which you seems to have. Bodies ? Ah, forget about them ; let them grow old , but never allow that piece of MEST to interfere with your “Spirit of Play”. Then, you’ll be forever young.
      :-)))

      FC : “and due to Miscavige greed you are sometime poor (but it’s relative, you spent it all but you made the money that you would not have made without such a pressure).”

      TC : I know about poor, alright , but I’ve learn with the years, that the only real and lasting “havingness” is your real understanding of the mechanics of life, and learning to “let go”.

      FC : “Bad end for someone who was top of the universe. A few amongst the few.”

      TC : You seems more alive than most people I know dear FC. Look at it as the beginning of a possible wonderful spiral, and postulate it through. It all lies in our attitudes, which are independent of “reality”. Reality is what you make for yourself ; it is a “Tierra Incognita”.

      FC : “You will excuse my english, it looks most of the time genuine but sometime I miss the right word.”

      TC : You are good enough that I thought it was your native tonge. English is my 2nd language , and I miss a lot !!!
      I am working right now in improving my grammar using “The New Grammar” by LRH and “Small Common Words Defined” , as well as other excellent grammar texts.

      FC : “I was quite interested by the exchange between Thetaclear and Maridli (are you a girl?)

      TC : I ask myself the same question. :-)))

      FC : “I used to think like you Thetaclear, conspiracy type. Miscavige is a Markabian! And so on. I thought all that since 1982. (and I had to say that I never heard of Sector 9 of Robertson before late nineties.)”

      TC : Yes, I wasn’t at all familiar with CBR’s stuff since quite recently. My perceptions were purely the result of tying loose ends, and by connecting dots ; plus a little undeveloped skill at perceiving possible “futures”. DM need not to be a “Markabian” at all ; just with being interfered with from far away, is enough.

      FC : “I was litterally striked by this perception. I was getting this message “we are loosing the war”. I was OT3 at this time. I felt and percieved the takeover of scientology without any data.”

      TC : Seems you are quite aware , FC.

      FC : “The worst moment was the new year event 83/84. There was the message from LRH, RJ38. Well I didn’t recognize LRH’s voice, a bad imitation. Couldn’t spot the being behind the voice, and if I tried to spot the speaker, he was not a 72 years old man, but much younger.

      TC : So it seems to me.

      FC : “There was no comm lag, no chukle, no heavy breathing of someone over 70 who smoked all his life. I realize that if my perception was true, that the tape was a forgery, then scientology was done, freedom was shut. And like you, Thetaclear, I hoped I was wrong.

      TC : Got it ; there was something definitively off.

      FC : “So many time in my life I hoped to be wrong. Hopefuly many time I was, it permit me to breath and enjoy irresponsability. But sadly enough I was not wrong on this one. Something very suppressive was cooking. And the cycle is not over. We are still in it. But this was about making sure scientologists will not make it.

      FC : Got it. DM started his plan to take over the Church long before LRH died ; probably around the ’80. With the “Clear Unit” supposedly created to “protect” LRH from being indicted, he was only severing every comm line to LRH except his. The very few others that kept a comm line due to various reasons (finaltial, legal, and medical) were under DM’s control as he was the CO of the “Clear Unit”. So DM basically controlled all comms from and to LRH.

      Pat was apparently his ally but he felt that Pat betrayed him with the fake FO about the “Loyal Officer” post. Also by pretending he had the alleged “OT” levels beyond VIII. I am quite sure there are none ; call it an “educated” perception of mine. Believe me, if they existed, and LRH would have done them, he wouldn’t have died like that with Dysphrasia and leaving everything in a bloody mess. It is highly illogical to think that LRH had any command of Full OT.

      FC : “You said, Thetaclear, a system of third party, yes of course. But I also hope it’s all blabla.But the fact that you think like me, trigger my itsa line. But it’s to some degree to painful due to the amount of wrongness. Maybe this perception is part of the trap. Yes it is!

      TC : Got it FC. You know how one effectively hide something ? Just make it “too incredible to believe” and you’ll win everytime. That’s a VERY old whole track trick played in all of us. It was said by LRH, and rightly so, that human’s biggest weakness is his unwilligness to confront evil. That’s our path towards slavery. I was endowed, since just a very small boy, with the capacity to “get” into people’s mind. I thought that this was rather normal.

      It created a lot of trouble for me in personal relationships, as I usually knew what the person was “thinking” even before the individual was aware of it. I could never miss a withhold on others. I got inside a girl’s mind back on the early ’80s. She had just came from the street (having left her own country-Haity- ,and just got into our Mission and “camped” on the middle of the FBO office (it was sunday, and she wasn’t in, just a few of us). She refused to leave, and was found out to be quite crazy. Nobody wanted to handle her as she was violent , and most of them were no Tech trained.

      As always, they resorted to me ; not at all because of my “training level” , as I had officially none, but because they knew that I had came from the streets. So I went into the room and had a “chat” with her. She was stuck in a Voodoo inc near a camp fire with a ritual being performed (this was apparently some lifetimes ago). I , not being highly trained, just thought of commanding her to “come to PT”. She started to scream upon hearing the “command” to “Come to PT”. I continued with it, just TR3ing it..She originated that present time was “too painful” for her. I handled her origins and just continued, but her screams were just too strong and like coming directly from Hell. At some point she calmed down and was more serene and cooperarive. I scorted her out of the building, wished her well and postulated her recovery. Never heard from her again.

      I only tell this story to ilustrate that confronting evil is an ability very lacking these days. We humans are VERY reasonable creatures indeed. It is so much easier to just explain everything the “normal and acceptable” way, than to just confront head-on incredible and tough possibilities. I never had a problem with confronting evil nor “SPs”. They are really nothing to me. Not a problem at all. I sent one of them (“with more than 6 SP traits” kind of SP) ro the hospital back in the ’80s as well. He was being very nasty, suppressing my sister. I was just tired the shit of him. So I just restimulated all his missed withholds. He ended up in the hospital. I felt terrible for a while, and learned to “control” my potentials. I became too soft then, and let a bunch of asshole Scientologists tell me what to do with my life.

      My life became a living hell. I had became timid to use force. When I finally recover my willingness to smash any head that needed to get smashed, nobody deared to mess with me again. I can be an angel, and a Saint ; but can also be a very deadly force. I know about evil, and I know about entrapment. What we are experiencing, is no human doing at all. But to each his own.

      FC : “Now, about the change in character of Hubbard. Maybe you listened or read this great lecture. “attitude and conduct of scientology” 3 November 1955. He said you should never disconnect and be mean etc… If you have never read it, I have it, i can mail it.”

      TC : Thanks, I’ve listened to it.

      FC : “It’s the opposite of wrongs indications, it’s so right. 10 years later he went tougher, Captain Blight valence. I don’t think it was hidden influence like the power push of 1982. He went just sour due to too many non compliances. Try to be in his position, he felt that he was not getting his points through and with such a bad troup he would not succeed. Maybe he was paranoid, but who is not who feel responsable. ”

      TC : I very much respect your viewpoints , FC. But you are only being reasonable here regarding this. LRH became despotic, period , and started on a path than only violated the most basics Human Rights. The more we scientologists try to “Not-is” this and fail in our responsibility to accept it as it is, and fail to acknowledge all the victims of his suppressive policies as regards that they were ACTUALLY a victim of Human Rights violations , the more BPC will be created.

      Scientology and LRH’s bad repute worldwide is a direct result of a failure to accept the many crimes commited., plain and simple. We Scientologists are the most “reasonable” people on Earth we it has to do with Scn or LRH, specially with LRH. We become blinder than a bat, and more deaf than a stone. We try to justify it all by utterances like “yeah, the he made some judgement mistakes” but he left us with an incredible legacy”

      . Go tell that to Karen that lost her son. Go tell that to the hundreds of separated families who has suffered heartbreaking pain of being disconnected with a broken ARC. Go tell that to the hundreds souls at old age that lost all their life savings in the name of a “total freedom” they never got. Go tell that to the hundreds young men (and girls) who were “forced” to remain in the SO w/out getting a professional education, and are now attempting to survive outside the SO with miserable jobs. Go tell that to a person whose son committed suicide overwhelmed by the decision to whom he should remain “loyal” ; to his parents or brothers. Go tell that to a mother who was forced to make “Sophia’s choice” , and chose between her daughter or drug adict son.

      Please, please, please, save your defence of LRH for another less aware terminal. I am a Human Right supporter, and I fear no truth no matter how unpalatable.

      FC : “And he lost some of his lightness, but it doesnt impact the tech or the basic policies like the data series. Please read “anatomy of thought”, that’s Hubbard! The basic law is what’s count, not the incidental fact. I think this blog is really good, it really invite to communicate.

      TC : No dear FC, what actually counts is how many you positively influenced by fostering Human Rights and freedom of choice over data. What really counts is how the life of others were more important than our own. What really counts is our kindness towards our fellows, and our capacity to grant beingness to others. What really counts is fostering the right to think for ourselves, and arrive at our own decisions, w/out a fanatical and fundamentalist “I am the only one capable of perceiving truth” attitude like LRH had. What counts is how self-determined we taught others to become, as opposed to subjected to the yoke of “Authority”. That’s what really counts, my friend.

      Take care.

      ARC,
      PETER.

      • Dear FG, sorry for changing your initials on my reply to you ; I just realized about it. And sorry as well, for so many misspellings ; I wrote it directly on my Android, and it is a pain.

        ARC
        PETER

      • Hello Peter. I can see you are tougher than me regarding Hubbard. The “fascist policies” have been for a short period of time. 65 till 68. Then he canceled disconnection. And I would say from 1968 to 1982, it was a kind of golden age. I supposed you read “security check abolished” from 1968.
        Now, it’s true that he had very much trouble with what he called “smersh” (as a humour reference to James Bond)
        It’s very sure that the despotic valence was alive on him. You say yourself that you can be tough facing evil. You’re just the same way than Hubbard. Being with certainty we all can “unleash power”. Warrior attitude is more pleasurable than victim. But when you loose any compassion, when your finger no longer “falter on the trigger” (even if “total freedom” is at stake!) then you become yourself evil, while fighting evil. And of course there are maybe hidden third party not really part of the physical universe. So auditing Not’s, Excal, or any such activity may vanish some ill from de world.
        Of course you quote some human right abuse. Myself I lost many friends but my family followed me on the “dark side”.
        But it has been said by Vaughn Young that Hubbard didn’t write the issue reinstating disconnection.
        I was very touched that you ack so well all my comm and gave your viewpoint. You are more of a tiger than me. But you’re right, I got your idea, I might create a new reality, and some of the pain is not the endless decay of life but it wash the world to create the future which will be desirable for all.
        Writing what I write, while being no religious by nature, I still can compare the destiny of Hubbard with this of other great philosopher. He didn’t end well. But he gave a huge hope where people did sacrify everything.
        The real betrayal was not the despotic attitude of Hubbard but the action of those who thought they could do everything to win the war.
        Miscavige and Broeker were even inventing a false grade chart and a fake issu (I think RJ 35 is completely faked, announcing OT levels which don’t exist)
        This is the biggest crime in scientology, faking source.

      • FG : “Hello Peter. I can see you are tougher than me regarding Hubbard. The “fascist policies” have been for a short period of time. 65 till 68. Then he canceled disconnection. And I would say from 1968 to 1982, it was a kind of golden age.”

        TC: Dear FG, thanks for the comm. I am afraid that 3 years of authoritarian-facist policies are more than enough to bring about general chaos and general PTSness, and more so when it was not allowed to bring LRH up in an S&D resulting in an “out-list” with all its consequences.

        I have VERY reliable sources that can testify that “Disconnection” was never really cancelled. I can reveal myself, but I had been in staff and SO lines for quite some time, so I am quite familiar with the actual reality of Orgs and the SO. Talk to any original class VIII and find out from them the many Human Rights violation practices that continued aboard the Apollo. Any old-timer can verify that for you. Read the “Otto Roos Debrief”.

        But let’s say, for the sake of discussion , that “Disconnection” was , in fact, cancelled. Just with the “Suppressive Acts List” PL , which was never cancelled, is enough to put Scn into the category of a cult(ish) movement. Just that policy alone is reponsible for an incredible amount of injusticies and pain.

        FG : “I supposed you read “security check abolished” from 1968.”

        TC : Of course I am ; I am familiar with almost every policy and lecture. But Sec Checks were promptly reinstated. Not that I never had (nor have) any problem with them ; they are a VITAL part to “Total Freedom”.

        FG : “Now, it’s true that he had very much trouble with what he called “smersh” (as a humour reference to James Bond) It’s very sure that the despotic valence was alive on him. You say yourself that you can be tough facing evil. You’re just the same way than Hubbard. Being with certainty we all can “unleash power”. Warrior attitude is more pleasurable thanvictim.But when you loose any compassion, when your finger no longer “falter on the trigger” (even if “total freedom” is at stake!) then you become yourself evil, while fighting evil.”

        TC : Yes, I understand what you mean ; I very much prefer understanding over force a hundred times. That LRH went despotic , is not really my issue ; I , for one, have enough accumulated overts so as to be able to build an Atom Bomb with their resulting energy ridges. My issue is with the misguidedly attitude with which so many Scientologists try to “tone down” LRH’s overts. He is expected, just as any of us mere mortals” are, to assume responsability for his acts ; and we are expected as well, to enforce responsibility, and the redress of wrongs.

        Too much injustices occured, and too many wrong indications resulted from authoritarian policies. Scientologists are generally attempting to justify LRH, and find reasons “why” he did what he did. He just DID it, period ; there is no need to either “analyse” why, or with trying to “tone it down”. Just accept that he was dead wrong about that, repair the injustices, amend the damage done, and rehabilitate LRH’s name by confronting and accepting the truth. There is no dishonor in embracing Truth ; only liberation.

        This misguided attitude from so many, of feeling our buttons pushed by critical utterances about Scn or LRH, is almost child-like, and even oppressive to ourselves. Let’s just grow beyond Scn and LRH.

        FG : “And of course there are maybe hidden third party not really part of the physical universe. So auditing Not’s, Excal, or any such activity may vanish some ill from de world. Of course you quote some human right abuse. Myself I lost many friends but my family followed me on the “dark side”. But it has been said by Vaughn Young that Hubbard didn’t write the issue reinstating disconnection.

        TC : That’s highly unlikely that LRH didn’t ; and it was never “cancelled” in actual reality. The evidence of that abound. Young’s assertions are only one man’s viewpoint of it all ; there are hundreds of others viewpoints that totally contradict him. Still I feel, with all due respect to your observations, that you are being reasonable as regards to that. But it is your right to so dissent , and I can respect all your views.

        FG : “I was very touched that you ack so well all my comm and gave your viewpoint. You are more of a tiger than me. But you’re right, I got your idea, I might create a new reality, and some of the pain is not the endless decay of life but it wash the world to create the future which will be desirable for all.

        TC : You are most welcome, FG. Really understanding the reality of others, is always a pleasure for me. You seems full of life and endowed with a lot of Theta. I don’t care your age ; you are very much alive to me. And pain is a condition only of the body, never of the soul. Futures are as bright as we make them, and there is always a new beginning available for each one of us.

        FC : ” Writing what I write, while being no religious by nature, I still can compare the destiny of Hubbard with this of other great philosopher. He didn’t end well. But he gave a huge hope where people did sacrify everything. The real betrayal was not the despotic attitude of Hubbard but the action of those who thought they could do everything to win the war.

        TC : I very much agree. I don’t see LRH as an evil intended being. He just got trapped in the “oppterm” of it all, specially regarding psychiatrists and government. DM and his minions, on the other hand, are VERY evil intended and incredible malicious.

        FG : “Miscavige and Broeker were even inventing a false grade chart and a fake issu (I think RJ 35 is completely faked, announcing OT levels which don’t exist) This is the biggest crime in scientology, faking source.

        TC : Yes, it is FG, it is.

        Take care team player!

        ARC, PETER

  15. Thank you Maridli. That’s really the profound viewpoint of LRH I believe. Then he was faced with counter-efforts and was aging. Being uncomfortable on an overweight body can make you in a bad mood. And facing difficulties, someone in charge may become harsh. It was said so often but it is true, he was not a saint. At the end of our lives we will remeber ourself when we were young and handsome.
    Thetans in aging body get sour. Auditing, execise, ARC, purpose and love may prevent it. Hubbard was in a conflicting world, he was fighting a war for spiritual freedom. What he left behind him is so much more than his flaws.
    Miscavige at best wants the shop to continue at any price like any manager. Aside that he is not bright enough to evaluate something which actually works, so he is wrong and insist heavily on being right. He is also sadistic, deeply abarrated and an autoritarian personnality as described in “an essay on management”. Fascist would be the word which fit best.
    Unfortunatly such guys sometime raise to power, they have no ethical problem to do the worst things to arrive there. People with an ethical sense would not be able to contemplate such a mind.

  16. PS I think that the HCOB where he says that a person who is making it go right has a lot of commotion around him is “The supreme test”. He just does describe his mind in 1967 when he wrote it. So beautifully written.
    “THE SUPREME TEST OF A THETAN IS THE ABILITY TO MAKE THINGS GO RIGHT.
    People who explain how wrong it is all going and who have reasons why and WHO AREN’T PUTTING IT RIGHT are the real crazy people in the universe. The only ones crazier than they are are the ones who are quite happy to have everything fail and go wrong with no protest from them. And the only ones even worse are those who work endlessly to make things go wrong and prevent anything from going right and oppose all efforts instinctively.
    Fortunately there are a few around who DO make things go right in spite of everything and anyone.”
    But if someone like Miscavige is applying that it might serve as a justification to act as a fascist.

    • Ah, yes – that’s an excellent reference. Thanks for reminding me.

      Btw, whenever you want to reply to a comment that has no reply button, you can use the reply button on the email notification for that comment. Let me know if you have any questions about this.

      • I had a reply button this time. I don’t receive email notification for the reply.
        Ciao Marildi.

      • FG, if you want to get email notifications, the next time you post a comment just click in the little box that is right below where you type the comment. Beside that box, it says “Notify me of new comments via email”. From then on, when new comments are posted in that particular blog thread, you will get an email for each of those comments, and at the bottom of each is a reply button you can click on if you want to reply to it. It’s much easier to follow exchanges when the replies are right below the post they are in reply to.

        There’s another box that says “Notify me of new posts via email”. Click on that and you’ll get an email each time BIC has a new blog post.

        Ciao FG! 🙂

  17. Hello Peter, thanks for your answers. I agree with you on most of what you say. I might be reasonable with Hubbard.
    But, it’s a matter of logic. When speaking with church members (when they sill speaked to me!), they said that the witness of Mike Rinder, Marty Rathbun and others were only lies etc…. My answer was : “why would they lie?” Having served scientology for so many years, they would start to invent abuse which never occured. Why that? It dosen’t make sense. You can’t find any logical reason why they would lie. Why would Debbie Cook cry in front of the juge? She worked so hard to manage Flag. She must having been so pissed with Miscavige that she felt she had to do something to dismiss the SP.
    I just says that about Young. Why would he lie ? Especially to a court. At the end he hated Hubbard, but what he said was discharging Hubbard. Why would he says that if it was not true? There was nothing to get out of that.
    When I read carefully HCOB reinstating disconnection , it’s completely 1,1. It start with big generalities about the right to communicate or not, to finally arrive at this paragraph which express the intent of the full text :
    ” Example: A pc is connected to a person or group that has been declared suppressive by HCO in a published ethics order. He should disconnect and, if he wants to inform the SP of the fact, he may write a letter of disconnection. Such a letter would be very straightforward. It would state the fact of the disconnection and the reason for it. It would not be misemotional or accusative, since this would only serve to stir up further antagonism. The letter would be inspected by the Ethics Officer before it was sent and copies kept for the PTS person’s own ethics file and pc folder. No attempt would be made to establish communication with the declared SP “to clear matters up” or to seek to reform the SP. The SP’s reform is strictly in the hands of HCO. The PTS simply disconnects.”
    That was the “hidden intention” shown as a simple example, on the midst of other data which were obvious to agree with. While it didn’t participate to the same logics (similarities are not simillars).
    In no Hubbard issue there is a hidden intention. It’s always straightforward with no illogics.
    From 1982, I was ARC broken with new issues for most (I was not a freezoner, didn’t even know it was existing). It was policies to stop (starting with OT eligibility). Not Hubbard brand, I feel it very deep. Didn’t fit at all with the research line of this time (Not’s).
    I could so well imagine a writer like Young faking an HCOB on Miscavige order.
    I’m not reasonnable with Hubbard. But saying Hubbard commit this issue is to wash clean Miscavige if in actual fact he ordered the fakery (an many others like the RJ from 35 to 39).
    If member still in the church could be demonstrated that Miscavige faked the source, the little tyrant would be out, out, out. And it is what is needed for the “greatest good” : Miscavige total oblitaration!
    When the responsablity is on Hubbard it unloads Miscavige from his crime. He was following Hubbard.
    I even wonder if this line has not been introduced by some OSA troll. It’s saving the ass of the little Goebbels and stop the evasion of members in the independant field. It proved that we are more or less anti-Hubbard so they stay on the church.
    Miscavige is the one who need to hang, not Hubbard.

    • Dear FG,

      Thanks for your comm. I understood all your points ; thank you.

      We obviously differ on that one point about LRH , but it is quite all right to dissent. They both ( DM and LRH as well) need to take responsibility for their actions. It is true that DM’s are a lot worse and evil intended, but regardless , LRH has his very big portion of overts agains many others which scientologists, most of them, never seems to be willing to confront and accept ; and that’s wrong. That’s very wrong ; nobody should be above justice, nobody, I don’t care if it is God himself.

      I , as well as anybody else, need to confront our overts and go up the conditions. No different with LRH ; he is expected to do the same. And I will very much follow his leadership again when he comes out of lower conditions ; plain and simple. And I will even help him with the cycle ; I have nothing against him as a being. I am only against Human Rights violations , and will not, ever again, get reasonable about cult(ish) approaches to freedom. Never again will I allow it to raise. I should have stopped it when I could. Now, I will finish my job.

      Some will consider me an enemy , and others a “light-bringer. Some will misinterpret my words as meant to create rupture and hostility towards the subject and LRH. Others will consider them as wisdom and Truth meant to free others of the suppressive yoke of “Authority” . The choice is individual. But I’ll get the job done, rest assured. My goal : a full rehabilitation and reform of Scn , full scale ; to revert the bad changes and recover a VERY workable lost subject that got lost due to authoritarianism and underestimation of human potential.

      I have no enemies ; not DM, not LRH, not anybody. My enemies are stupidity, ignorance, and unkindness ; and I should only fight those, never a being himself. Rehabilitate power of choice over data and the ability to think for ourselves, and all the doing of DM , or from any other cult leader for that matter, will be totally undone. That’s basic Truth ; all else are just complexities as the result of our own unwillingness to duplicate. There is really no “evil” ; there is only beings that violates their personal integrity and code of honor. Only then can any “evil” has any real consequences on ourselves.

      ARC, PETER

      • Yes Peter. I get your point but I don’t make that on the ground of ethics or “who is worst”. That Hubbard was at some point completly fucked up is just one thing.
        No, my point is that I want to know who the hell wrote the damn HCOB PTS and disconnection and the RJ from 35 to 39 as they are the main issues which have changed the politics of the church. There are outpoints tending to say that those are fakery. Witness of Vaugh Young and this http://www.freezone.org/reports/e_ssqpjt.htm
        That is all what I am saying. It dosen’t include saving the repute of LRH. Being reasonnable would be, not doing the eval to real find what actually happened. I’m just interested by knowing the truth whatever it is.
        There is those days also a kind of “politically correct” in the independant scientologists to incriminate Hubbard. When you defend him, means your a kind of reasonable independant kool aid drinker.
        Ok, Hubbard did some overboard and was a despotic bastered. (I’m not trying to excuse himI wouldn’t give a damn about that)
        But he told us that when the TA rise on dianetics you ask for an earlier similer incident. That is a key datum. This is the legaçy!
        The rest is only his bad temper! After all he was not Hitler, not even Georges W Bush. But the little tyrant is not of the same kind of being. He is a damn sociopath.
        You see Thetaclear, I don’t think anyone faithful to Hubbard will consider you as an ennemy for your viewpoint. You are very measured, and I’m too. With a sense of relatives importances.
        But having been once a data evaluator I can say that Hubbard’s character is not the major aerea of outpoint. Someting has been very wrong in 1982, and none ever did unravel it for real, aside maybe, Bill Robertson. But he didn’t have actual data, just perceptions. And when I speak about Robertson, let me tell you that I am not member of Ron’s Org. I’m just looking.
        Much love to you Peter.

      • Dear FG,

        Thanks for you comm. I understood your points and agree with most of them.

        I am very clear about LRH’s legacy, and in fact , have made it quite clear in numerous of my posts and in my recently posted article from 2-3 weeks ago (“On Free Will , Fundamentalism, And The Workability Of Scientology”). In it , I clearly establish the workability of Scn based on my own experiences in applying it to hundreds of individuals. I established as well, the difference between “The Tech” (as regards to HCOBs on auditing and case supervision) and “Admin and Ethics” policies.

        I also got your point on “PTSness and Disconnection” and RJs 35-39. But I can’t agree with your assertion that “they are the main issues that has changed the politics of the Church”. You see, some or many might allege that those issues are not LRH’s. But regardless of the validity or lack thereof of those allegations , it is a FACT and not Peter’s viewpoint or opinion, that the “Suppressive Acts list” PL is pure LRH ; he never ever cancelled it , period. He revised it a few times before DM was even an executive. I have the originals, unrevised by the Church.

        Just with that PL , dear FG , w/out even taking into account the issues that you mentioned , great Human Rights violations are committed which result in heavy PTS scenes and in general injustices. So it is really inconsequential whether those issues are LRH’s or not as regards to evaluate LRH’s switch in character. You also have the 1955 piece “The Scientologist : A Manual On The Dissemination Of Materials” , which clearly demonstrate the beginning of this change in viewpoint. I am afraid that you are looking “too late in the chain” , dear FG , when attempting to establish accountability.

        As to what happened around 1980-82 , there can only be speculations and a general “mystery sandwhich” for many, including myself. Even though that I frequently do speculate about it , I only do it to amuse myself, as it is an answer I don’t really need. It is enough for me to know that : a) Something went wrong , b) LRH changed , c) Scn went by the boards and became a cult. All else are just too many significances for me , and not vital for the full rehabilitation of the subject , which is really my purpose, and not to “blame” LRH.

        On a purely personal note regarding that “Mystery” , though, I do have a theory and an “educated guess” : “Hidden Influences” are and has been operating in this planet since a VERY long ago time (from the first Hominid through “Homo Novis”). But Humans tend to dismiss just too easily the “incredible”. That’s why it is effective. Me, I never had a problem with that, as I am quite new to this society, and wasn’t even around when R6 happened. So I never had a problem with “the incredible” which is actually the “normal operating basis” in “advanced” societies.

        No “OT” level in existence ,not even “Excalibur” fully handles the “Hidden Influences” ; not while still in a body, as it has been carefully “genetically manipulated” , and is the BEST theta trap ever devised. I don’t know if CBR’s “GE RD” actually is capable of handling this or not. My intuition tells me it won’t ,but I’ve never done it, so it is only a biased opinion.

        The target to handle is The Body itself. Doesn’t it strike you as strange how “Exteriorization” never seems to be a stable state for practically anybody ? First we had the SOPs (SOP 3,5 and 8) , then SOP 8-C , 8-0 (to create Operating Thetans instead of just Theta Clears) and SOP-8D (to handle the being stuck in “universes” problem as a barrier to Exteriorization- see the similarity with what NOTs handle : universes). None of that was stable. “Theta clears” and “Cleared Theta Clears” were never a stable state.

        Then it came, as a possible solution (as LRH found the the umwillingness to follow instructions and being stuck out od PT had some bearing with this) the Standard Operating Procedure of 8-C (the Objective process , I mean) ; the first actual process that could easily be effectively taught to auditors (the first “Training” breakthrough). With that one process , followed by Route One from COHA book, Exteriorization was tackled again. On the PCs that wasn’t ready for Route One, then Route 2 was completely run, and then he was put on R-1 again. Most of the R-2 processes are part of the Grades now. The problem still persisted.

        Then LRH sort of abandoned it all and started the SLP (“Six Levels Of Processing”) issues (5-8 , I think) , and the “Operational Bulletins”. It was followed by many CCHs and the various “Clear Procedures” which also contained 6 steps now including CCH-0s (Help Processing). Still the problem continued, specially due to the “Step 6 Phenomena” (the “Beefing up” of the bank with “Creative Preocessing”). He then concentrated on “Clearing by Valences” , CCHs and O/Ws on reading terminals.

        It all was abandoned with the discoverey of the “Free Needle” as “Floating Needles” were called back then. Before F/Ns e-meter phenomena was mostly used only to establish charged areas and specially terminals to run. With the discovery of the F/N as the manifestation of “releasing from the bank or some of its parts” , Exteriorization was found to be an “End Phenomena” upon which a process had to be stopped to avoid “Overrun”. LRH erroneously decided that continuing beyond the first Exteriorization had been ALL the problem. So he just dropped it all.

        Then, because apparently Exteriorization was a VERY recurring phenomena even when not attempted by “modern” processes, causing many case manifestations (see the Ext-Int HCOBs Series) , he developed its solution : The Exteriorization RD and The End Of Endless Ext RD for Clears and OTs , but just to avoid further problems with furthers Exteriorizations as a result of processes not at all aimed at that goal.

        The “Old OT Levels” , once again attempted to create stable Exteriorizations, and the L12 attempted, quite unsuccessfully I might add, to produce “stable” Exteriorizations that any L12 completion fully knows that it is frequently vague, and not lasting at all, in spite of all the allegations from LRH issues on it.

        Then NOTs was developed to handle that (it was not developed by Mayo at all as many wrongly assume) problem , but the rest is a well known history. NOTs handles nothing of this sort, no matter the incredible wins to be had from it. So we are again at square one regarding Exteriorization.

        That’s why my emphasis on “Secret OT VIII” issue that pretty much everybody assume it is fake. Well, if it is fake, the one who wrote it, either was an avid Tech researcher who knew Tech upside-down, or was at least an experienced class XII and OTVIII (original OT VIII). On that “fake” bulleting the author discusses the reason “Why” Exteriorization was never a stable state for all those years. He also discusses the body itself as the perfect “Theta Trap” , and how it is that w/out fully handling that 3rd and final “Wall Of Fire”, no lasting Freedom would ever be attained by Humans. Some VERY interesting comment to give some thought to.

        So, a very responsible, unbiased, and professional research should be done into this. The problema is that most Homo Novis just love their bodies, and the thought of parting from it is just too much for them. But even that could be handled by old SOP V , overcoming the need for bodily sensations by gaining the certainty that all possible sensations could be just as easily obtained directly from the environment w/out any vias from a body. That’s the final barrier to handle : the need for sensation ; and this fully includes the need for “Sexual Sensation”. See ? I am already becoming unpopular ! :-)))

        Take care dear FG, we are fine. You was wrong : You ARE a tiger. :-)))

        ARC, PETER

    • FG Ive been watching your responses and comm. Im tracking and understanding your feelings on this. I like your old timer VP on the topic. It seems experiencial and on the mark!

      Im a relative new commer to Scn,1995 was my first contact. I joined staff almost straight away, blew after my first Int rundown. Took 8yrs to find my way back. I never experienced the old days as you did, unless you take earlier track into account. I always felt there was something funky, not quite right in the church, but I had too much certainty on LRH and the tech so I battled on with the vigour of youth! Now older and wiser I can say Ive made great strides in advanced level bridge progress to say something of small merit to add to this conversation. It is this:

      LRH did not figure it all out. He perhaps failed to handle 3 or 4 key areas in how to achieve his goal.

      The hidden influences

      1. Intereference from theta universe beings LRH hadnt discovered yet and the procedures to handle them.

      2. Other whole time tracks which are impinging on this time track.

      3. Propper tech to handle the GE directly which also gets messed with unbeknownst to the thetan.

      4. A more thorough method of erasing the R6 bank completely.

      Having a look at the above will put things into a much better perspective as why LRH did what he did. It helped me dramatically!!

      • Sheeplebane. You are right but your points are really almost all included in the Not’s data.

  18. Hello Peter. Thanks for your answer I do agree with the fact that the illness start earlier then 1982, as regard to that it’s “too lateon the chain”. My point is only if it can be prooven that the issues I quoted are fake to nail Miscavige and dismiss him. Of course it will not happened but one can dream! You see the problem is what Hubbard wrote or didn’t wrote (not to wash Hubbard from his sins again!) Or basically the idea of source. What is Miscavige source of? What did he write? For exemple I strongly believed that “smash the squirrels” (you read http://www.freezone.org/reports/e_ssqpjt.htm ?) is an authentic document from Miscavige proving then that RJ38 is a forgery. Arising the question then what was LRH doing at this time?
    You see the idea is to find what LRH was doing at this time, what were his thoughts. It’s true there was a big change introduced from 1982. Very contrary to basic tech. “OT elibigility” for exemple is in complete contradiction with HCOPL “The flaw” where Hubbard says that the basic flaw of civilisation is “inspecting before the fact”, and that it can make a civilisation fail. From 1982, witholds one gave in session were reported to ethics to be “handled”. That was no longer scientology. Hubbard couldn’t have authored such a contrary fact with the basic laws.
    I strongly believe that if he would be there now he would say : “Of course I didn’t write that shit. Couldn’t you tell?”.
    You see that’s my point, my perception of truth. If he would be back and someone tell him he was wrong with his “SP policies”. He would say that it’s right, even write an issue like “After much trouble and experience I can tell that no autoritarian attitude will ever succeed in the handling of human aberration”. You know I’m mocking up the man.
    Robertson has mocked up Hubbard thoughts or maybe channeled him, making what he wrote (admin briefing for exemple) like actual prophecy in the eighties of what will become of the church.
    The idea is really to identity the source, the ownership, even for the sake of knowing the proper ownership of an origination. Like a big Not’s RD! By the way, of course Not’s was from Hubbard, with Mayo as an assistant. Maybe few ideas are also from Mayo. And so what? I don’t see any outpoint in that.
    Now, I did New OTVIII. And I can tell you it’s not any “truth revealed” nor it handled any “amnesia on the whole track”. This is all bull shit dreamed up by poor Ron’s faker. New OTVIII goes nowhere really. The main process works but is certainly not an OT level, and is more like at best a little rundown. They had to deliver an OTVIII that they promised so they made up that one. Now they couldn’t mock up any more OT levels, so they created impossible prerequisite, in order to not ever deliver it and to keep the customers buzzy and still get the money flowing. If that was the intent, let me ack Miscavige, it worked.
    But what about the actual OTVIII? I’m afraid to have to tell you my dear Peter that you might be right.
    Yes ” HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE
    Saint Hill Manor. East Grinstead, Sussex

    HCO BULLETIN OF 5 MAY 1980
    LIMITED DISTRIBUTION ISSUE I

    OT VIII Course Students
    OT OT VIII Auditors
    OT VIII C/Ses
    AO Review Auditors
    AO C/Ses
    OT VIII Series I

    C O N F I D E N T I A L

    STUDENT BRIEFING

    By the time you read this I will no longer be occupying the body and identity
    that you have known as Ron….. ”

    It doesn’t look fake… Actually it’s just making so much sense, the style is so much LRH style. Who could have ever invented such a thing? Even a class XII couldn’t. But you can’t put aside that it is possibly an invention of a gifted faker!
    It’s no more crazy than OT3 was.
    “Jesus was a lover of young boys” of course doesn’t help!
    But the amount of incredible concept there are amazing. Oddly enough there is some similarity with Excalibur, which was more or less “telepathically” co-authored by Robertson and LRH. In case where it really would be an actual level I wont engage in a discussion about it. But it’s serie 1. So where are the other issues? So many mysteries.Then you start to hope it’s all bull shit, and while having a scientologist life, you missed to have a good homo sapiens existence for at the end contemplate such a story. Maybe Miscavige thought “this is too crazy, the old man has gone nuts. We have to do something to save scientology…”
    …. Make you want to forget the whole thing and go the the beach!…

    • Regarding OTVIII, it sounds like you did one of the fake versions – there were least 5 or 6 released over the years by Miscavige. There IS a genuine LRH version that was meant to be a VERY long level – as stated in that bulletin you quoted. It was only delivered for a few months in 1988 before it was discarded. However, in my opinion, it was never done correctly even by those few people who did do that original version. As I see it, it was meant to take many months, ever years, to finish it.

      • This story of 5 or 6 OTVIII release by Miscavige is a tale to me. There was only one new OTVIII as far as I have more or less asked people who did it. From the maiden voyage in 1988 to PT. It’s the one I did myself. It was written in 1985.
        Now the one from 1980, aside it’s maybe just an invention of a brilliant Ron’s faker, I don’t think anyone ever made that one. In case it would be a real level, there is no apparent process or application.

    • FG : ” Hello Peter. Thanks for your answer I do agree with the fact that the illness start earlier then 1982, as regard to that it’s “too late on the chain”. My point is only if it can be prooven that the issues I quoted are fake to nail Miscavige and dismiss him. Of course it will not happened but one can dream!”

      TC : Thanks for the comm dear FG ; yes, I do got your point now. Thanks for the TR3! :-)))

      I also think that many issues from 1982 on , are either fake , or very alter-issed ; like the “Eligibility” issue that you mentioned , and yes, probably “PTSness and Disconnection” as well. Naling DM for it ? Now, of course we can dream! :-)))

      I also share the opinion that if someone with enough altitude , and specially self-respect, would have emphatically handled LRH to take a real good look at the “SP” issue , he would probably had amended it at least. The problem with that was that almost all Scientologists saw LRH as an God-like individual incapable of errors, and thus assumed that somehow he must have been right about issues they didn’t fully agree on. The life of a great leader is not easy at all ; there are so few willing to take responsibility for them , that they usually get lost in their own O/Ws and individuate from others (see the lecture “Individuation” from the ACC, “Responsability And The State Of OT” ; very revelatory indeed).

      About “identifying Source and proper ownership” as in NOTs , that’s an excellent point indeed.

      Mayo? I don’t have a problem neither, if he participated in suggestions in the research of NOTs. Mayo is an incredible smart individual , and one of the first ones to have the balls to dissent. The Church would not be in the mess it find itself now if Mayo would have been the leader instead of that crazy fuck. Mayo has self-respect and integrity. He was subjected to incredible injustices and plain fundamentalism. “Harmonics of Clear” being a “squirrel” interpretation ? Give me a break please , has anyone actually read that issue ? They made such a big fuss over nothing , really. “The greatest ‘SP’ that Scn ever had”. Oh, come on ? I would rephrase it as “The first free mind that Scn ever had”.

      FC : ” Now, I did New OTVIII. And I can tell you it’snot any “truth revealed” nor it handled any “amnesia on the whole track”. This is all bull shit dreamed up by poor Ron’s faker. New OTVIII goes nowhere really. The main process works but is certainly not an OT level, and is more like at best a little rundown.”

      TC : Yes, I know it is all BS, all right. I bet you was one of those students that looked around you, and stared at your fellow students with a bewildered kind of face, with the thought “Is that it ? , is this all of it ?” , after opening your part B pack.

      Calling is a “RD” is to be too kind to it. :-))

      “New OT VIII” could have easily been put at the very end of Solo-NOTs, right before attesting to it. I mean , it is only logical to had done so. New OT VIII, actually is an extension of NOTs ; that’s all it is. And its “EP” is actually kind of a joke ; the biggest betrayal of all, in my perspective. You are very happy for having finished Solo-NOTs at last, and ready to confront the “First OT level” (yeah right) and become a “baby OT” (but a REAL OT). You are ready to recover your total track recall ; something vital for Total Freedom (by the way LRH do mentions OT VIII actually handling your ammesia on your whole track in the class VIII lectures). But what you find instead ? You find a C/S 53 and more NOTs !!! to supposedly “handle” something that should has been fully handled at Solo-NOTs. Talking about cynical betrayal !

      But that betrayal wasn’t the doing of LRH at all ; it was fully the doing of DM with the full agreement of the then SNR C/S (Ray Mithoff). The overt that took Ray to the hole and subjected him to be the effect of a being that is an Ant compared to Mithoff’s potential.

      DM just didn’t want real OTs around, period. Whether this was actually the “channeling” of implanters or not , I don’t really care ; the product is the same. But let me point out to you, DM has no real intelligence to pull that off by himself. He is smart, but not that smart. I think we still haven’t met the real being behind the throne. Its revelation would just stun anyone, and I am not in the mood to break realities today. Perhaps some other time. Nobody would believe it anyway, so why even waste my time.

      FG : “They had to deliver an OTVIII that they promised so they made up that one. Now they couldn’t mockup anymore OT levels, so they created impossible prerequisite, in order to not ever deliver it and to keep the customers buzzy and still get the money flowing. If that was the intent, let me ack Miscavige, it worked.”

      TC : Exactly so, FG. But a REAL OT VIII do exist , believe me. And DM fully knew about it. It wasn’t in “unissued note form” at all ; it was fully written up. And I believe we’ll have it with us real soon. How exactly ? Well, I would have to “erase your memory” If I were to tell you. :-)))

      FG (regarding “OT VIII secret bulletin) “It doesn’t look fake… Actually it’s just making so much sense, the style is so much LRH style. Who could have ever invented such a thing? Even a class XII couldn’t. But you can’t put aside that it is possibly an invention of a gifted faker! It’s no more crazy than OT3 was. “Jesus was a lover of young boys” of course doesn’t help!”

      TC : Yeah, the “Jesus thing” didn’t help at all, all right. Now, that “gifter faker” would have to have been fully versed with almost all LRH lectures, and have a full command in the Tech. I know about “styles of writing” , and pretty much can recognize the difference between styles ; and let me tell you, this writer has just too much an incredible similar style to LRH’s, just too much. I just don’t buy its lack of authenticity. That bulletin just connect all dots, and fully explain many hitherto unexplained phenomena.

      FG : “Then you start to hope it’s all bull shit, and while having a scientologist life, you missed to have a good homo sapiens existence for at the end contemplate such a story. Maybe Miscavige thought “this is too crazy, the old man has gone nuts. We have to do something to save scientology…” …. Make you want to forget the whole thing and go the the beach!…

      TC : “Forget about the whole thing” is never an option, dear FG, never. And there is nothing to miss about an “Homo Sapiens” existence. What is there to miss ? Mortgages payments ? Good cars ? The cat, the ballons, the dog ? No, that’s not a life for me, not for me. There are “vistas never seen before ; sensations never felt before” , paraphrasing LRH. I rather keep on dreaming ; dreaming is so much closer to Freedom than losing hope.

      Take care my friend ,always a pleasure exchanging good comms with smart individuals like you.

      ARC, PETER

  19. FG:
    “This story of 5 or 6 OTVIII release by Miscavige is a tale to me. There was only one new OTVIII as far as I have more or less asked people who did it. From the maiden voyage in 1988 to PT. It’s the one I did myself. It was written in 1985.”

    There was a discussion on Marty Rathbun’s blog a few years ago – several OT VIIIs attested to the fact that different versions had been released over the years. There was even a case of a husband and wife – both OT VIII – who had done different versions, several years apart. In addition, Karen de la Carriere wrote about a meeting she held with a number of OT VIIIs in attendance – they discovered that there had been at least 5 versions.

    George White – who did the original level in 1988 – is planning a follow-up to his book “Lucifer’s Bridge”. It will be a detailed examination of exactly how OTVIII was delivered.

    • I’ll be very interested. By my own expercience I only met people who did the same level that I did, including people who have been on the maiden voyage in 1988. I also knew married couple who did the level at different years. One in 1988 with the maiden voyage, the other in 1990, none of them seemed to have done a different level.You see, even if they are not allowed to speak of it, they would allude and be quite bewildered. Anyhow if the “lucifer level” was ever delivered it would be at the begining in 1988. I did new OTVIII myself in 1989 and I’m quite positive that anyone who did it later did the same than mine, no exception. But if you have a link on any of this witness you quote, please provide it.
      But by my own experience, people who speak about those different versions have most often not done OTVIII themselve. After all the ship didn’t miss with security, the written material of new OTVIII (the “official” one) never leaked at this day. Of course some people who did it and left the church felt free to tell the story, and it was always the same story. It doesn’t mean that it was “source” but was the “official” level delivered by the church.

      • FG,
        Here are a few links:

        https://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2011/03/16/truth-revealed-about-ot-viii/

        Karen#1:
        “Marty will confirm that the “VERSIONS” of OT 8 have keep changing through the years til the 80s *EDITION*, 90s Edition and 2005 *EDITION* and 2010 *EDITION* are pretty UNRECOGNIZABLE.”

        https://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2012/05/22/another-ot-viii-has-seen-the-truth-revealed/

        Path of Buddha (George White):
        “The original OT8, which I completed on the Freewinds, was much longer than the current version. In the original OT8, we were treated as qualified auditors. It actually was a lot of fun and I was given freedom by the C/S in order to look for certain manifestations which applied only to me.
        The original OT8 narrative spelled out a broad outline of causation and required a lot of word clearing. I think Miscavige got rid of it because he did not understand it.”

        Starman8:
        “My wife and I recently compared notes, we did different processes altogether. Me, early last decade, and her 8 yrs later. That’s two different versions just there.”

      • Hi, Maurice. Thanks for that additional data. I’d like to add to it with a quote from an article by Class XII Pierre Ethier:

        ———————————-
        “Its core issues written up in 1969, LRH found OT VIII to be ‘only for a High level Thetan’, and the gradient simply too steep for most people, even a Full OT 7 completion. It took nearly a decade for tech to be developed to address those points.

        “Finally in 1978, LRH triumphantly announced that NOTs was the answer and the prerequisite for OT VIII. NOTS was found to be a far longer rundown than originally expected. Unfortunately over the next few years, RTC and the CSI (Church of Scientology International) re-wrote the bridge solely for ‘Marketing’ and ‘Income Making Purposes’ and not for ‘technical Reasons’. NOTs, became ‘New OT V’. The Solo NOTs Course (NOT an OT level, by any standard), became ‘New OT VI’, and Solo NOTS (essentially the continuation of NOTS auditing, but done Solo, became ‘New OT VII’.
        […]

        “OT VIII was originally written up in 1969. Around 1983, LRH wrote the final piece of that Rundown, a final step intended to polish up and stabilize the results.

        “Either deliberately, or perhaps, more accurately, as a direct result of the unawareness brought about by the burden of heavy overts, the individuals responsible for compiling OT VIII, for its 1989 release aboard the Freewinds, entirely disregarded the original OT VIII materials and merely released the ‘final piece’ as if it were the entire Rundown. The rest is History. In spite of the carefully controlled hype, the original release of OT VIII went like a lead balloon. Within just three months, well over 10% of its original public completions were dropping off like flies either dead or seriously ill, or victim of an accident or a crime. Many of the ‘younger public’ were either tepid about the results or per actual session records, simply incapable of running the level with any substance or reality. The actual technical reason is actually not hard to imagine. Beside the fact that they were missing the majority of the rundown, younger public had never done the Original OT VII. The Original OT VII is a beautiful Level that has a lot to do with the ability to project one’s Intention across. OT VIII was originally developed assuming everyone would have done OT VII prior to it.”
        ——————————–
        http://www.upperbridge.org/OT8PLUS.htm

  20. Dear Peter, we are feeding thought to each other. It’s a process by which we try to reach a truth. Of course we are missing data, but our angle of view seems quite bright (why not congatulate ourself after all?).

    “Exactly so, FG. But a REAL OT VIII do exist , believe me. And DM fully knew about it. It wasn’t in “unissued note form” at all ; it was fully written up. And I believe we’ll have it with us real soon. How exactly ? Well, I would have to “erase your memory” If I were to tell you. :-)))”

    Well I’d like to know more about this if you can.

    “DM just didn’t want real OTs around, period. Whether this was actually the “channeling” of implanters or not , I don’t really care ; the product is the same. But let me point out to you, DM has no real intelligence to pull that off by himself. He is smart, but not that smart. I think we still haven’t met the real being behind the throne. Its revelation would just stun anyone, and I am not in the mood to break realities today. Perhaps some other time. Nobody would believe it anyway, so why even waste my time.”

    You caught me in a mystery. After all this article was about Miscavige, so you are on the subect. Please, tell me your idea.

    “TC : “Forget about the whole thing” is never an option, dear FG, never. And there is nothing to miss about an “Homo Sapiens” existence. What is there to miss ? Mortgages payments ? Good cars ? The cat, the ballons, the dog ? No, that’s not a life for me, not for me. There are “vistas never seen before ; sensations never felt before” , paraphrasing LRH. I rather keep on dreaming ; dreaming is so much closer to Freedom than losing hope.”

    I got your point. I could describe how I lost faith. I use to be quite OT, a real scientologist and an auditor (and also an artist). But some bad experiences made me postulate to be an homo sapiens. I will not make a description of the events but they are pretty standard on wrong indications business. If you read on Mike Rinder blog http://www.mikerindersblog.org/andy-porter-speaks/ the story of Andy Potter (so incredibly well written with the right emotion), mine is similar and I would add even worst. When you are through that, you’re done. Your body is also very bad off. Those heavy engrams are of the same magnitude than the huge wins gotten previously. But you start to regret not to have gone spending you money in hollidays.
    Well, I can’t really itsa this just like that. But it has created a real invalidation which stuck to you, giving a feeling of heavy loss and incredible apathy. So you start not to believe in OT stuff, looks weired. Maybe it’s the theta trap we are talking about.

    Ok, we just cannot stay on this post forever. But really this suppression it’s all about Miscavige and other system forces as LRH says in History of man.
    “Thetans are bound here on earth by other system forces” History of Man.

    • FG : “Dear Peter, we are feeding thought to each other. It’s a process by which we try to reach a truth. Of course we are missing data, but our angle of view seems quite bright (why not congatulate ourself after all?).”

      TC : Yes, indeed ; why not do so. You are right about that. :-)))

      FG : “Well I’d like to know more about this if you can.”

      TC : About Original OT VIII getting finally in the Field pretty soon (1-2 years max) , I can’t really say much ; it’ll put me at risk. But I do can tell you that OVIII was fully written up by more or less 1969. You can find refs to that regard in the class VIII lectures, including the one about it being capable of handling “Ammesia in the whole track”. “NEW OT VIII” is for the birds as an “OT” level. As an “correction list” , or as a minor RD it has its uses ; it is always a good thing to assign the “correct identity” to things, and the correct “ownership”. I mean, that’s what NOTs is all about. It is an extension of NOTs. It could have easily been put at the end of Solo-NOTs. It is sort of a “repair action” more than anything.

      Listen to the class VIII lectures in a new unit of time, if you have already listened to them before. LRH describes phenomena from OT VIII in more of one ocassion. You also have “OT Orgs” HCOPL about one piece of advice coming from OT VIII (original) , where LRH mentions that it “would probably revive the death!” It deals with the subject of “Purposes”. NEW OT VIII has nothing to do with purposes. Doesn’t it strike you as strange that you have to read and W/C the whole of the “History Of Man” , and you then you expect to enter into “strange and ‘heavy’ stuff” to then be confronted by sort of an extension of NOTs ? I mean, why the hell can one possibly need “History of Man” to do New OT VIII ? It just doesn’t make sense.

      My especulation (and my educated guess as well) is that the “History of Man” was originally used in Original OT VIII ; actually used and not just read. HOM deals with the GE line , a subject not touched at NOTs. Now let’s tie a few technical knots here. With NOTs (Audited and Solo) , you supposedly get rid of everything close to your space and mostly in your body that isn’t you. You end of with a very particular perception of the body (relax, KSW supporters, I am not saying too much , ok?). But you never deal directly with the GE, right ?

      The next logical step is to deal with the GE ; and what a coincidence that “LRH” talks EXACTLY about handling the “biological implant” (the GE) in the secret “OT VIII” bulletin , and that the “History of Man” is one of the first steps you do at NEW OT VIII (at least W/Cing it). On the “Game of OT : Exteriorization and Havingness” lectures from the ’56 , LRH take up again the subject of the GE, and even the processing of it ; a very interesting set of lectures to listen to. On the PDC lectures , LRH also discusses the GE at length.

      Are we really that naive to even think that our “masters” , “care-takers” , and “wardens” are just going to make it easy for Earthlings to discover their true spiritual nature, and just be able to easily exteriorize at will with full perception and control of MEST ? Not a chance, I assure you. That would be just plain incompetence. It is just logical to assume that the body has been thoroughly booby-trapped ; just a logical assumption indeed. Hence, original OT VIII and then modifications/additions of the 1980.

      No Scn process in existence, including L12, is capable of producing stable Exteriorization with full perception and full movility ; NONE. And it had been attempted by LRH since 1951 !!! The body that Humans love so much is the “Theta Trap” par excellence. This underserved love and admiration for it is for the birds. “Food” , “Sex” , ah, so many “wonderful” sensations! Except there are so low level , so insignificant compared with what we as beings are capable of. I experienced them so many times in my life, that it is too difficult to just let go. It is an extasis so wonderful, so “out of this world” , that it is Freedom itself.

      FG : “You caught me in a mystery. After all this article was about Miscavige, so you are on the subect. Please, tell me your idea .”

      TC : Perhaps in private, dear FG ; but almost all you need to know is in HOM book , and in “The Role of Earth” lecture. There are those who consider all this as just a very entertaining Sci-Fi ; to each his own, I guess. I am not wasting my time trying to “convince” anyone. I was born with a gift, and I intend to fully develop it and use it.

      FG : ” I got your point. I could describe how I lost faith. I use to be quite OT, a real scientologist and an auditor (and also an artist). But some bad experiences made me postulate to be an homo sapiens. I will not make a description of the events but they are pretty standard on wrong indications business. If you read on Mike Rinder blog http://www.mikerindersblog.org/andy-porter-speaks/ the storyofAndyPotter (so incredibly well written with the right emotion), mine is similar and I would add even worst. When you are through that, you’re done. Your body is also very bad off. Those heavy engrams are of the same magnitude than the huge wins gotten previously. But you start to regret not to have gone spending you money in hollidays. Well, I can’t really itsa this just like that. But it has created a real invalidation which stuck to you, giving a feeling of heavy loss and incredible apathy. So you start not to believe in OT stuff, looks weired. Maybe it’s the theta trap we are talking about.

      TC : I fully understand you, FG ; and I am really sorry that you had to go through all those injustices. I read Andy’s story ; VERY incredible indeed. I am not going to break your reality by pretending that I fully understand what you and others have gone through ; that would be even disrespecful of me. I never had such experiences with the Church ; I was always too much a pain in the ass, and I broke quite a few heads in the way. I’ve done many things wrong in my life, even of a criminal nature ; I am everything but a saint. But I never allowed no crazy dick-head to ever fuck with me. I left the SO when some assholes high executices tried to suppress me. I simply said “no fucking way” , and just routed out. Some big shots tried to convince me otherwise (4-5) of them, but I handled each one as I wanted. I never bought no bullshit from anyone. I am excellent at smashing heads.

      You know FG, for me it is a matter of self-respect and self-esteem. I just never agreed; never allowed anybody to treat me like a slave. I can play being very suppressive myself when I want it. I don’t want to sound rude or evaluative to you or others, but w/out self-respect, w/out Personal Integrity and self-esteem ; others just suppress you right and left. The basic “overt” of most Scientologists is not on the 2D or the 3D ; their basic “overt” is on their 1D : The abandonment in their belief in themselves, and of their Personal Integrity.

      And my apologies in advance for what I am about to tell you, but by feeling apathetic about it all, just are just “rewarding” their down stats , and failing to yourself. You let them do all that to you; now you need to go up the conditions on your 1D and make it up to YOU ,not to anybody else. Surrendering is never an option, my dear friend ; it never is. You need to make it up to you for the damage done to yourself by violating your own code of honor. Never be the effect of your own Cause.

      Get a good C/S in the Field (I know the best there is reparing NOTs and Solo-Nots) , and just go and repair your Solo-NOTs. You owe that to yourself. Forget about Excalibur for a while. One needs to repair old programs (incomplete or badly run) before engaging in new ones ; that’s how it works. New programs doesn’t repair old ones. That’s standard C/Sing. Then, or before it, do Mary Freeman’s “Integrity Program”. Do it with her ; it can be done over Skype easily. The life changes from that program are expectacular. It deals with YOU as a being. It result in finding the best friend you will ever had : YOU.

      You’ll never be able to step off life. Nobody can, and nobody really wants it neither once they have a taste of what real Freedom is like. There is no other way out but through it. Read and apply “OT Orgs” PL. Rekindle your failed purposes ; they are ALWAYS basic in the chain ; they are Truth. All else is fully dependent on them. Just recall many times the purposes you had before all that happened. Do it many times in spite of any negative ridges turning on. Continue with it till you fully recall such basic purposes with all the emotions that accompanied them. Do it, then get with me, I’ll help you through. It is never too late to start again. It is never too old.

      FG : ” Ok, we just cannot stay on this post forever. But really this suppression it’s all about Miscavige and other system forces as LRH says in History of man. “Thetans are bound here on earth by other system forces” History of Man.

      TC : Very true my friend, very true. But it is our duty to find the solution to it. More action needs to be done, and less thinking about it, and discussing it in blogs. Let’s all raise beyond pain, frustration, hopelessness , and defeatism, and fully embrace the inner Cause inherent in our nature. There is no joy in losing ; and losing should never be an option.

      Take care dear FG, I hope that you come back to the path that leads to enlightenment.

      ARC, PETER

  21. Yes Maurice, it’s quite startling. There is also an article on Tony Ortega blog about Georges White. A survey should be done on people who did OTVIII in 1988.

    • Thanks for the link Maridli. This summ up form Pierre Ethier is quite interesting. It give some reality on this famous OT levels IX to XV. I thought that it was all marketing invention. But in case he wouldn’t have dreamed up himself the log lines for this levels, where did it get it from? And where are those data? Of course it’s exciting. To some degree it blows a failed purpose that the bridge is over after solo not’s. But where are those levels? If the church has it, why do they wait so long? Maiden voyage was in 1988. I did OTVIII in 1989. I was young now I am 25 years older, and i’m about sure it will not take 25 more years until I drop the body!
      They are waiting that all their old OTVIII become past life OTVIII before to release OTIX!?
      No, simply those levels don’t exist and Pierre Ethier is nicely creating a dream from simple title he read on the grade chart.

      • You’re welcome, FG.

        I think we still have the dream we always had, and it can still come true. Joe van Staten expressed this well in his article on the blog post that follows this one. I posted a comment there with an LRH quote which indicates that what we already got from scientology is enough for us to go all the way down the road to truth. Here’s that quote again:

        “You’re only trying to free him up to a point where he can recognize that he can have freedom. And after that, all the freedom he gets will be given to him by himself. But you get him up to a security where he knows he can have freedom, and he’s on his own. I mean, you can’t go any further with a thetan.” (2nd ACC, 19B OF 9 DEC 53 “BODIES” 1/2)

        Here’s a link to the full transcript: http://www.matrixfiles.com/Scientology%20Materials/Tapes%20in%20order/5311c17%2002nd%20ACC/txt/5312c09%202ACC19B%20Bodies%20Part%201.txt

  22. About NOTs which was mentioned above:

    I was on the very first NOTs course at Flag in 1978. As per NOTS series 1 the purpose of the R/D is to handle ill effects from Clears having been run on Dianetics. Very soon it was changed to also be a prerequisite for OT VIII, but that was NOT the original purpose. Originally it was a remedy which not everybody needed, but it was very soon made part of The Bridge… probably because it sold well to double the price of ordinary auditing.

  23. Hello Peter, it’s a very warm answer. You are right on so many points. Especially on ethics on the first D. But, looking at actual events where one is heavily suppressed the tendency is to become cautious and very careful. Maybe it’s wrong. Sometime it helps to survive on the physical universe.

    Regarding OTVIII it’s a mystery. I know 4 OTVIII
    The one I did.
    Why thetans mock up from 1969, this one at least look fully source and relate with known bulletins (this one concerning drugs about mocking up) but was never applied and doesn’t have any process sheet.
    The student briefing from 1980. With also no application and doubt about possible authenticity.
    And Excalibur but it was not written by Hubbard even if very much inspired by him.

    How those three things might relate to each other if they does, I don’t really see. It was a pleasure to exchange our viewpoints. I would futher communicate with you but on a more private basis if you agree. Therefore I ask the moderator to send you my mail.

    • FG : “Hello Peter, it’s a very warm answer. You are right on so many points. Especially on ethics on the first D. But, looking at actual events where one is heavily suppressed the tendency is to become cautious and very careful. Maybe it’s wrong. Sometime it helps to survive on the physical universe.”

      TC : You are most welcome , dear FG ; I fully understand about your need to be “cautious and very careful”. That’s actually a plus-point. Incompetence abound these days. I rather “Solo-process” everything in my life that deal with incompetence, so I really get it. But there are competent people out-here, I assure you ; and VERY friendly and normal. :-)))

      FG : “Regarding OTVIII it’s a mystery. I know 4 OTVIII The one I did. Why thetans mock up from 1969, this one at least look fully source and relate with known bulletins (this one concerning drugs about mocking up) but was never applied and doesn’t have any process sheet.”

      TC : Got it ; it actually has some “suggestions” for possible processes based on the principles out-lined. It is sort of a “Power processing” for OTs , and sort of a “universe splitting” process. Some data regarding that can be found on ACC 4 which covers SOP-8D.

      FG : “The student briefing from 1980. With also no application and doubt about possible authenticity. ”

      TG : Got that too. If it were me, I would explore the GE implants outlined in the HOM book, with the e-meter. The procedure in how to tackle them is right there in the book. “Solution to Body Behavior” part 1 and 2 lectures from the “The Game of OT : Exteriorization And Havingness” set , also has other guidelines as well.

      FG : “And Excalibur but it was not written by Hubbard even if very much inspired by him.”

      TC : I understand. However, the many success stories from hundreds who have done it can’t be ignored either. They are just too many of them to prompt us to at least take a real good look at it.

      FG : “How those three things might relate to each other if they does, I don’t really see.”

      TC : May be they doesn’t need to be related at all. They might just be different angles to attack different areas.

      FG : ” It was a pleasure to exchange our viewpoints. I would futher communicate with you but on a more private basis if you agree. Therefore I ask the moderator to send you my mail.”

      TC : The pleasure is all mine, my friend ; and of course that is quite all right with me for you to communicate with me privately. It would be an honor.

      Dear BIC Admin , would you be so kind and provide FG with my e-mail address ? Thank you.

      We’ll keep in touch, dear FG. Take care.

      ARC, PETER

  24. Peter, the HCOB I wanted to quote is HCOB 8 january 1969 : Drug and “insanity” non-compliance and alter-is.
    It says : WHEN THREATENED WITH UNMOCKING A THETAN MOCKS UP OBSESSIVELY .
    Actually the datum is a small bit from OT VIII data, being part of energy creation. (and so many more interesting things)
    It relates well with HCOB 1 october 1969 Why thetans Mock Up.
    I don’t think anyone audited that. It also relate with this policy which tell about rehabbing the failed purpose to blow the barriers and to advocate total freedom. All this is from the same concept.

    I very often had a threeat feeling and I mock up like mad. He wrote that before not’s, one would have to evaluate how it relate to not’s.
    I think we will have to pilot. Write process sheet, case supervise. Do Hubard’s work if we actually want to go a little bit higher!

    • FG : “Peter, the HCOB I wanted to quote is HCOB 8 january 1969 : Drug and “insanity” non-compliance and alter-is. It says : WHEN THREATENED WITH UNMOCKING A THETAN MOCKS UP OBSESSIVELY.”

      TC : Thanks for the ref, FG.

      FG : “Actually the datum is a small bit from OT VIII data, being part of energy creation.(and so many more interesting things) It relates well with HCOB 1 october 1969 Why thetans Mock Up. I don’t think anyone audited that.

      TC : Yeah, probably not, unless one did SOP-8D. In SOP-8D, one uses one of the Qs from “Why Thetans Mocks Up” as part of its procedure. You can find SOP-8D in the “Creation Of Human Ability” book (the recent version) , and on the 4th ACC.

      FG : “It also relate with this policy which tell about rehabbing the failed purpose to blow the barriers and to advocate total freedom. All this is fromthe same concept.”

      TC : Yes, that datum apparently came out of the original OT VIII research. It has saved my life in more than one time. I was “dead” as a being like 12-15 years ago. Still with a body , but very much “dead in the skull”. I had a VERY severe Out-Int problem that apparently never had been handled in all the repairs that I had done on it including the “End Of Endless Int RD”. The MEST universe suddently had started to look “funny” , sort of distorted and “thin” (not very solid). It also felt sort of “detached”. I could see lots of “anchor points” running around my space, and I was in a sort of “time limbo” , neither in PT, the past, or the Future, but in all of them at once. Space got totally collapsed in me to the point that it felt that I “didn’t exist” , like a “nothingness w/out space”.

      It was so overwhelming , so strong, that I wanted to drop the body, but I fully knew that I was experiencing something a lot lower than “Death” on the scale ; way lower, probably around -20.0 , so why even bother.The purpose so sought by me, having real mass about the tones below death , had finally been accomplished, but I didn’t like at all how I arrived at it. I suddently had mass about how exactly it “feel” being “nothing” , or being incapable of “hidding”. Or about “total failure” as a being. Some VERY weird ,strange , and incredible overwhelming shit. I wouldn’t want that not even for the worst of the worst of the enemies. I had died as a being. I discovered that the pit actually has no bottom at all ; it is actually an “infinity of time” in misery. I spent like 3-5 years like that. Can anyone imagine 3-5 years of feeling “no space” and “not existing”. Now compare that to the DM issue ; he is just nothing to me really.

      That’s why no Human Emotion or petty problem can possibly shake my beingness in any way. That’s why I learned to appreciate existence, and am and will continue looking for the actual route that leads to salvation ; cause I’ve seen it all ; I have touched the bottom of all possible bottoms even worse that drug addiction, being murdered, being implanted, being bankrupty, being crazy (crazy is actually good as you at least are “unaware” of the pain) , being totally suppressed, et. , etc.

      That’s also why I want so much the salvation for others ; cause apparently I was given a “test” of exactly how it feels to be in “eternal pain” , in a pit where light can nevet enter. That’s why I feel a little sad when I see others waste this little chance we have to turn things around. We are losing at this moment , we are. Harsh times are approaching, but nobody seems to be able to listen . We must “wake up and smell the coffee” , and start philosophizing less and doing more. We must keep ourselves in the “Route to Truth”.

      Anyway , the subject of “purposes” and the “rekindling” of them , was which brought me ” back to life”. So it is a VERY, VERY powerful data.

      “FG : “I very often had a threeat feeling and I mock up like mad.”

      TC : Yes, I can fully realate to that. Actually thetans are doing it all the time ; it is “inherent” in us. It is VERY different than “Thinking” , and it is actually a high wavelength. The problem is with doing it unwittingly and obsessively. That’s why the original research into full Operating Thetan (all the SOPs) was done with “Mock up Processing”. Mock up Processing/ is actually a VERY high OT process, probably from original VIII up. The exact LRHref to this regard can be found at the “Illness Breakthrough” lecture from the “Expanded DNs” lectures. You’ll love them, I am sure. I can e-mail you a copy if you want.

      FG : “He wrote that before not’s, one would have to evaluate how it relate to not’s.”

      TC : He found that there also were others “things” mocking up like mad. So you have the problem of “ownership” of mock ups. That’s why “Mock Up processing” sometimes bugged so much besides your “Step 6 Phenomena” ; the “beefing up” of the bank (in unclear people) due to the “obsessive create” before the “Clear Cog” and other abilities.

      FG : “I think we will have to pilot. Write process sheet, case supervise. Do Hubard’s work if we actually want to go a little bit higher!”

      TC : I very much agree, FG. I pilot proyect is indeed needed to complete the Bridge. Waiting for the supposedly “15 levels above OT VII” is just a pipe dream indeed. Better roll our sleeves up, get our e-meters, and start doing some hard work with the C/S series , the class VIII materials, and the basic axioms as our guidance. Then, we can get somewhere.

      Thanks for the comm, dear FG.

      ARC, PETER

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